Clarification on gas powered airsoft over 500 FPS

[Dog Face Killer]

So I'm thinking of getting ether the Tanaka M700 AICS or the Maruzen Type 96.

The question's are these:

If the gun shoots over 500 FPS, by law is it not considered a firearm that needs to be registered and that you need a PAL for?

Two, if it shoots over 400 FPS but under 500 FPS, is it not considered a BB gun that could easily be imported bypassing the Airsoft B.S. at customs.

Now i know some of you are gona say that ill still run into problems at the boarder and bla bla if i try to get it in as a BB gun as opposed to Airsoft...but I'm just trying to understand this gray area...then again i might be totaly missing something as well.

Fire away!

[BBS]

the Tanaka is power adjustable. i'm not sure of the newer models being manufactured in japan (restricted to 300 or so fps only). if it has the pcs (power control system) it will still pass customs becuase you can turn the power down and use duster with it. also the box wont state the max power it can put out as its only tested with duster in Japan.

[Dog Face Killer]

Originally Posted by BBS

the Tanaka is power adjustable. i'm not sure of the newer models being manufactured in japan (restricted to 300 or so fps only). if it has the pcs (power control system) it will still pass customs because you can turn the power down and use duster with it. also the box wont state the max power it can put out as its only tested with duster in Japan.

What your logic around it getting past customs with the PCS??? I'm not arguing, just asking if you can expand a little on your reasoning...I'm not clear on how the PCS would be a deciding factor for customs/the law.

[BBS]

we'll seeing that high powered guns ( KJ M700, Tanaka M700 lineup etc) still make it into Canada i dont see a problem with the power; mainly because they never inspect the fps it puts out. from what i understand, the customs couldn't care less regarding the power. Furthermore the pcs is set to Japan's limits when it comes off the production line so if the customs really want to test it, which they never, it will be under 500 fps.

but all specualtions aside, if you crank it over 500 fps you have a firearm. That fact is unescapable. The part of whether or not the gun can make it across the borders is not a problem; its can you live with the fact you're holding an unregistered firearm.

[Dog Face Killer]

Originally Posted by BBS

we'll seeing that high powered guns ( KJ M700, Tanaka M700 lineup etc) still make it into Canada i dont see a problem with the power; mainly because they never inspect the fps it puts out. from what i understand, the customs couldn't care less regarding the power. Furthermore the pcs is set to Japan's limits when it comes off the production line so if the customs really want to test it, which they never, it will be under 500 fps.

but all specualtions aside, if you crank it over 500 fps you have a firearm. That fact is unescapable. The part of whether or not the gun can make it across the borders is not a problem; its can you live with the fact you're holding an unregistered firearm.

Ok...now im a little confused on your reasoning here. Why is it that the guns in question would make it across the boarder and lets say a "Maruzen MP5" would not. Both are Airsoft guns marked as "Airsoft" guns...for all intents and purposes as far as Customs in concerned, they are both "airsoft". What is it that specifically differentiates the two to customs. Is it a marking on the box that states the FPS is over 400FPS..etc?

[BBS]

sorry if i cant articulate my english. haha english is my second language. some times it would state the fps on the box. but why would a random gun like the "Marzen MP5" not make it across if you have the right legal documents and procedures?

[TokyoSeven]

Well, just speculating I guess, but well if I was a customs agent who didnt know any better, and this is all hypothetical. I would most likly believe a person who is claiming an a tanaka m700 as a BB more than a person claiming a mauzen mp5 because the m700 kinda actually looks more like a BB gun than the mp5. Like I said all hypothetical.

[BBS]

yeah we need more people chiming in. i cant explain it well haha.

[ex]

I haven't read REPLICA mentioned here. It's my understanding that if you did try to import this thing and it got seized, if at tribunal you could not prove that it fired over 500 fps you would be in a world of hurt. Now if it does then you have to register this as a firearm and you are bound by the laws of the land where firearms are concerned. I.E register said piece and hold a valid PAL. It's not just customs your going to encounter on this journey the RCMP are going to be very closely involved with the investigation. Unless this thing is a clear soft (which it isn't) it is not worth the risk IMHO. There are too many what if's and could be's in this area. But that said all cases that have been shown here (on ASC) point to the negative in the end. A replica is a replica in the eye's of the law. Just my two cents worth so take it for what it's worth.

[BBS]

wait a sec...wasnt his question asking if he can legally import an 500+ fps airsoft gun?

[Dog Face Killer]

Originally Posted by BBS

sorry if i cant articulate my english. haha english is my second language. some times it would state the fps on the box. but why would a random gun like the "Marzen MP5" not make it across if you have the right legal documents and procedures?

Ah, this is in ware the confusion of our conversation lies!!!

I have read on a few posts now that there are a handful of airsoft guns that qualify/fall inline as a BB gun under Canadian law...thus they are not prone to the "special" import licensing required to "legally" import airsoft into Canada under the current laws.

And now im about to go "off topic" on my own post...lol

If indeed there are a handful of airsoft guns out there that fall into the BB/air gun (not Airsoft or replica) category because of their FPS rating, why is it that we (the Canadian Airsoft community) are not patishioning (wrong spelling) the Airsoft manufacturers (KSC, Maruzen...etc) to develop or upgrade a class of gun for the Canadian market that sidesteps the laws...ie, markings on the boxes that clearly state the FPS rating and classification as a "airgun".

Maybee im off my rocker on this one, but.......

[TokyoSeven]

Ive gotta agree with ex-royal on this one. Just be wise, its a scary and freightfully long ordeal if things turn sour.

Originally Posted by Dog Face Killer

If indeed there are a handful of airsoft guns out there that fall into the BB/air gun (not Airsoft or replica) category because of their FPS rating, why is it that we (the Canadian Airsoft community) are not patishioning (wrong spelling) the Airsoft manufacturers (KSC, Maruzen...etc) to develop or upgrade a class of gun for the Canadian market that sidesteps the laws...ie, markings on the boxes that clearly state the FPS rating and classification as a "airgun".

Canada itself is to small of an airsoft market for them to invest any interest in really.

[ex]

Originally Posted by BBS

wait a sec...wasnt his question asking if he can legally import an 500+ fps airsoft gun?

It's still a replica. Regardless of what name you put on it, so that has to be part of the equation when trying to import one.

[Dog Face Killer]

Originally Posted by ex-royal

I haven't read REPLICA mentioned here. It's my understanding that if you did try to import this thing and it got seized, if at tribunal you could not prove that it fired over 500 fps you would be in a world of hurt. Now if it does then you have to register this as a firearm and you are bound by the laws of the land where firearms are concerned. I.E register said piece and hold a valid PAL. It's not just customs your going to encounter on this journey the RCMP are going to be very closely involved with the investigation. Unless this thing is a clear soft (which it isn't) it is not worth the risk IMHO. There are too many what if's and could be's in this area. But that said all cases that have been shown here (on ASC) point to the negative in the end. A replica is a replica in the eye's of the law. Just my two cents worth so take it for what it's worth.

Point taken....but we are also missing the point at the same time.

If the gun fires over 400FPS yet under 500FPS, based on law it is considered an "Airgun" witch we can freely import till our eyeballs fall out of our heads without needing any bullshit licenses for. The problem with airsoft is that they are in this limbo zone of not being a firearm (over 500FPS that need to be registered..ie, PAL) nor are they an "airgun" (400 to 499FPS). Most are in the two hundred and change to 300 and change area (FPS)...thus they are considered a "replica".

See what im getting at?....now, there may still be the issue of the "replica"...but there are many BB and pellet guns out there that you can buy at Canadian tire that are replicas of various guns...you don't see anyone complaining!!!

[BBS]

Originally Posted by Dog Face Killer

Ah, this is in ware the confusion of our conversation lies!!!

I have read on a few posts now that there are a handful of airsoft guns that qualify/fall inline as a BB gun under Canadian law...thus they are not prone to the "special" import licensing required to "legally" import airsoft into Canada under the current laws.

And now im about to go "off topic" on my own post...lol

If indeed there are a handful of airsoft guns out there that fall into the BB/air gun (not Airsoft or replica) category because of their FPS rating, why is it that we (the Canadian Airsoft community) are not patishioning (wrong spelling) the Airsoft manufacturers (KSC, Maruzen...etc) to develop or upgrade a class of gun for the Canadian market that sidesteps the laws...ie, markings on the boxes that clearly state the FPS rating and classification as a "airgun".

Maybee im off my rocker on this one, but.......

the only ones that are called bb guns and dont require any special documentation to bring in are the canadian tire like clearsoft guns. there has been some success stories of clearsoft making it accross the border when imported privately. the rest are airsoft guns (TM, KSC, CA etc) and they do require a lot of work and legal processes to obtain them. btw: fps, mostly, has nothing to do with importation.

Originally Posted by TokyoSeven

Ive gotta agree with ex-royal on this one. Just be wise, its a scary and freightfully long ordeal if things turn sour.




Canada itself is to small of an airsoft market for them to invest any interest in really.

i agree too if you want to do this proceed with caution and dont expect any good outcomes.