|September 3rd, 2010, 10:33||#1|
P90's 101 Guide/KS P90 Review
This is a review of the KS P90 (both TR & RDS) /an overview of all P90's from its RDS & TR models to the Magazines.
I firstly apologize if I missed to mention something. I know I did, so if you notice anything that needs tweaking, pm me, Thank you!
I will be updating this review every so often with new info I receive, or when new P90 specific products come out.
The P90 I own is a KS P90 RDS converted into a TR version.
Experience wise I have been running a P90 as my primary for the past 4+ years, and have used or at least examined majority of the P90s on the airsoft market to date.
If you don't want to read about everything I will try to give you a quick overview of P90's below.
Company's That Make P90's
Basic Models or Variants Available
Magazine Sizes and Availability
Batteries that fit the P90s
PRICING AND PACKAGING
The box the gun comes in is a simple brown box, with no markings what so ever on it.
Standardly the gun comes with ONE FULLY TRADEMARKED Low Cap (68RDs) Mag with fake bullets, manual and such, charger, 8.4 Battery, unjamming rod, an orange and black flashhider, and depending on if you got a TR or RDS version a Socom Silencer or PS90 External Barrel (Varies from store to store, silencer and PPS90 Barrel are ONLY FOR TR MODELS).
Price ranges on this gun go from $300-$600+
I purchased this gun in the summer from a local players (not stating) for $450 (came with mags and such) who I had been in contact with when he first got the gun, and used it for a year. When I first got my hands on the gun I had used it for over 2 months prior to that so I got some fielding experience with it before purchase.
A year later I bought a second KS P90, this time the RDS version that came with a metal upper receiver, and FN Trades, something I have not seen on the market for a stock P90 other then from CA or aftermarket companies.
Anyways the gun right off the bat is made of the typical polymer plastic body and metal upper receiver. The polymer is very sturdy and does NOT feel like some cheap plastic that could break easily. The metal receiver is quite sturdy and has a top PICATINNY and an individual side rail on each side of the receiver for lasers and flashlights. The thread adapter or barrel threading on the front of the receiver is made for 14mm CCW (-) silencer and flashhiders. FULL FN Trades have been placed on the LEFT hand side of the gun like the real steel version. Now these are actually stamped on and not painted on like the Echo1.
The upper receiver can be removed quite easily with the push of a tab located on the body of the gun along the mag well (where the magazine sits). By removing the receiver you can access the gun's inner barrel and hop up unit very easily. This allows quick swaps of the inner barrel if need be at a game.
Same things all are the same on the RDS, as listed above, other then the upper receiver, which of course has a built in RDS into it, with only one left side rail, however an assortment of aftermarket rails are available to use specifically with the RDS' upper receiver.
To load magazines simply slide the magazines on to the mag well and push into place, personally to prevent damage to the magazine and the mag well I push back on the mag release, slide it down then tap it into place.
The stock padding on the gun is a bit stiff but feels great on the shoulder, you can however get an extended stock that provides a more comfortable/cushiony padding.
Now internally, from what I saw when I opened up the gearbox is that internally, this gun seemed quite similar part wise to the TM P90.
P90's all use V6 Gearboxes (same gearbox as the one used in Thompsons)
Some V2 and V3 parts are compatible with the V6 gearbox, however I still suggest V6 specific parts if and whenever possible.
Overall, the V6 Gearbox is a very solid gearbox, durable and should last quite a long time if maintenance correctly.
Comes with a 247mm Inner Barrel usually (CA P90 TRs with silencer come with a 430mm barrel)
Only the G&G and King Arms (Nylon Fiber model ONLY, NOT the Ultra Grade (ABS) model) come with quick spring gearboxes.
WARNING: BEFORE OPENING UP YOU GUN's GEARBOX, I STRESS YOU WATCH TUTORIALS ON YOUTUBE BEFORE DOING SO. IF YOU HAVE TO OPTION OF A GUN DOCTOR SEND IT TOO HIM, IT IS A LOT STRESSFULL THEN DOING IT YOURSELF, TRUST ME!!!!
Keep in mind that the gun was a year old and had been used quite a bit by the previous owner so it was in need of some TLC maintenance. To access your gearbox, remove the two screws that keep the plate that keeps you gearbox in position. Once you remove it take the gearbox out and go nuts. Remember keep every parts that is on or comes off that box in a safe place or it will not run without it!
Below are links to videos of how to disassemble and reassemble the gearbox, along with break down graphs of the P90 (gun itself and magazine even)
Companies that produce P90's
P90's have 3 following magazines available on the market:
Now high cap's hold 300 rds and have to be winded. What I have found is that mid and high cap mags are very touchy, they can feed very well or just be shit overall
(misfeeds,etc) I tend to suggest low caps but its up to the player.
NOW many ask WHAT MAGAZINES ARE BEST for the P90?
This is what I have found over extensive research.
Low Cap Magazines are the BEST P90 magazines on the market. They create great realism with the fake bullets and round capacity. However pricing for these go anywhere from $20 - $40 dollars apiece. The company who makes the best Low Caps is of course Tokyo Marui. However KS, Classic Army, and Echo1 low caps all feed well regardless.
If you are an ammo waster and tend to be very trigger friendly I suggest the High Cap Magazines. NOW please note that ALL P90 high caps tend to be like a love hate relationship. For some players, high caps feed wonderfully (I myself use a high cap that feeds fine) HOWEVER others find that the high caps tend to miss-feed, double feed, jam, etc. Personally with my past experience with these magazines and what I have seen, I suggest sticking to Mid Cap Magazines if low caps aren't enough rounds. If you must insist on High cap mags though get the TM ones, they have the highest success rate.
Now Mid Cap Magazines tend to be just like the high cap magazines. Some feed fine some don't, this goes for the Mag Mid Caps. I have however been able to confirm that King Arms, Silverback and Pro Arm Mid Caps feed fine even with upgrades and a high rate of fire.
So overall for P90 Mags, I SUGGEST get low caps and/ or Midcaps if you can. Stay away from the high caps from my experience.
P90 Built in Red Dot Sight
There are currently 2 P90 models out on the market today. One being the Tri Rail version, and the other being the Built-in RDS version. I have used both and read a lot up on the RDS version so here is what I found.
The RDS Version has been talked about for a while now, debating whether the RDS itself is of good quality of not. First off on older P90 RDS models the RDS was a semi okay built sight with changeable brightness levels. However many found that the RDS was ghosting, glaring, too weak, etc. So TM recently made an updated version of the RDS. The updated versions work wonderfully and have no issues like its past model.
Now why I suggest the RDS Version over the TR version is only cause of the fact that aftermarket Tri Rail Systems ONLY fit on the RDS Version's Receiver, via removing the RDS. I personally like the look of it more, and on top of that makes the gun look more unique and relative to the current real steel TR FN P90.
Keep in mind though, the TR version has 3 rails while the RDS has only 1 side rail on the side of the receiver. Which one you get is up to you though.
Here's a video comparing the RDS from CA, KS, TM and the Real Steel version - Airsoft P90 Red Dot Sight Comparison v2 - YouTube
Just like other AEG's P90's can use almost any standard battery however there are Custom P90's batteries built specifically for the TM P90's. Unlike all the other P90's on the market, the TM ones are the only ones that all have a smaller battery compartment, rendering most standard sized batteries useless without a mod. Now like I said before there are custom batteries made for the P90 (L-Shape or J-shape looking) you could get, there are also battery compartment extensions available, or the optional and rare cheek plate that also acts like a compartment extension.
As it was brought to my attention (thank you lurkingking), the CAs has a shorter compartment then the TM, roughly .5mm to 1mm shorter.
Now all other P90's (Echo1, TM, etc) all have a big enough compartment to fit any battery that is no longer then this though (can get larger battery lengths to fit with the extension).
Of course all P90's will run on Lipo batteries as well. With certain changes to the wires, possibly motor/gear, and other internals, to accommodate the increase in ROF.
On top of that, mosfet units can also be attached to the gun's internals with some handy work.
To sum it all up, the P90 can fit a standard small type 8.4v and 9.6v mini battery, a nun-chuck, custom p90 batteries, and most of the smaller lipos.
Just some advice, a 9.6v nimh is equivalent to a 7.4v lipo
You can find various sling mounts that attach via the sling point on the stock of the gun. King arms and CM (China Made) produce a set of mounts that are metal and almost all have quick detach sling points on them. Then there are also mounts that go on the flashhider, or slings that go through the sling opening on the receiver. You can youtube or google them to see examples.
I own a Big Dragon P90 Sling, which wraps around the stock of the gun, only thing is that the sling setup I use is similar to the StarGate ones, I added an extra strap/buckle to the sling that wraps around the gun's trigger guard and connects to the sling on the stock of the gun (See pictures below). This allows me to use an integrated sling
So the next best sling out there is the Stargate one which is available at thevestguy.com
A 1 Point, 2 Point, and even 3 Point sling can be used, depending on the mount you buy, any will work though like a Magpul, Blue Force Gear, China Made, etc. Sling.
Like which P90 model you choose, its up to your personal preference on what mount works best. All and all they all do the same thing aka hold your gun
Pouches, and Dump Pouches
I have seen everything from people using M4 pouches and extending the top with velcro to fit the magazines to people just storing them in their pockets. Now I personally use Magazine Pouches specifically made for P90, UMP and Thompson mags. Companies like Pantac, Condor, and Tactical Tailor produce top quality P90 specific pouches while there are some Chinese Made pouches which are a lot cheaper (quality and price wise). I suggest these over your make shift or creative pouches as it is a simple solution that will safely keep your mags secure in the pouch. However I recently acquired HSGI (Both the Rifle & Extended Pistol) Taco pouches, these both hold P90 mags in place very securely and are a good solution for those that want to run other platforms but don't want to constantly switch out pouches for your guns.
Now in regards to the HSGI Extended Pistol Tacos I should point out for one, the new Taco pouches are actually pre-stretched out now, so it is not as much as a bitch to install the malice clips on them (I was able to install them without any pliers). After finally getting them installed I don't really have any issues with them, they are like my normal Rifle Tacos, the retention system works perfectly and holds the magazine in place, I am also surprised on how short the pouches actually are. Despite how short they might seem compared other P90 mag pouches though they still work just fine if not better.
My only 2 issues are that the magazines don't completely push all the way down into the pouch (see images below), there is about a inch of space between the bottom of the pouch and the magazine. Now this does not affect the performance of the retention system, however it does cause the magazines to ride a little higher than some would like. This could probably be fixed with long term usage/wear to the Kydex overtime or simply re-molding it.
The other issue is that the pouches do push the magazines away from my body more than I expected (see images below), again it is more of a personal preference, I personally like it since it allows me to access my handmic/ admin kangaroo pouch on my Shellback Banshee Plate Carrier.
Now for the Dump pouches, the story is different. ONLY thevesyguy.com makes a specific dump pouch for P90 mags, however many companies now a days do produce longer dump pouches that should accomodate P90 magazines along any other magazine you might use. You'll have to do some research on which companies produces what, but shouldn't be too hard.
(UPDATE: I did purchase the dump pouch from thevestguy for $100ish, it's as real as it is going to get. Ultra Durable, works very well, def worth purchasing)
A couple companies like Pro-Arms make a mag clamp that holds 2 magazines together as well. On top of this there are Freedom Magazine holsters, which work very well if you are running a belt rig.
You can find more about these via google
Conclusion/My Opinion on the Gun:
I love this gun plain and simple. This is a great gun that can be used for indoor and outdoor play. I use this for outdoor play and it is able to keep up with the likes of M4s, G36Cs, and Sig552s. The mobility, maneuverable, comfort this gun offers is outstanding. NOW I am 5'6" and skinny so ideally this gun is a great fit, however if you are 5'8" or higher lets say, you may feel uncomfortable wielding this gun as it is made to be held very close to your body (hence the Bullpup design). HOWEVER I have seen big guys using this gun without any problems so it's really up to you if you want to try it out or not.
If you are playing outside I suggest getting a inner barrel that extends into a silencer, however if you like the flashhider look, the standard 247mm inner barrel will do just fine and has similar results as a longer barrel surprisingly. I played at Op Rhino with it and it is definitely one of best options for CQB/urban playing fields. Was easy to turn corners quickly, conceal myself, and was able to hit targets at 125 feet. Of course if you upgrade the internals of your gun you should be able to hit most targets even with the shorter 247mm barrel.
Now people will always ask "what is the better P90) and my response to that is there is no better P90, it is all based on personal use/budget, however if you were to ask for my opinion on it I would say this. I prefer the Tokyo Marui (TM), King Arm (KA)s, or Classic Army (CA) P90s over others on the market. Now keep in mind this is just an opinion.
TM would be my first choice not because it was the first P90 that was on the market, but internal wise, the quality is top of the line; even for stock parts. I use a lot of TM parts in my personal P90, as well as the externals are solid. They are reliable and durable, plan and simple (performance/quality). The only drawback is pricing and sourcing one out on the market, they can be pricier since they are TM but the money paid is well worth the quality.
KA would be my second choice, they offer a replica of the latest/last Real Steel P90 models that were made, internals are very good quality, the externals are solid, and the pricing for one is the best on the market. It also includes a quick-spring change gearbox, which is very helpful and always good to have. They perform very well, but at the price it is sold at ($200 - $300 range) you can easily afford upgrade parts for it. This would be my ideal go to gun I suggest to people looking for a P90. I say it is the best overall P90 on the market currently (price, quality, and performance wise).
Finally CA is my third choice, it is the heaviest of all the P90s on the market, which gives it more realism, which I like. The body is also one of the most solid on the market. It has decent internals, from what I have heard, the gearbox in this gun is very picky with certain parts, but I have no experience (just word of mouth) with this, so I'd ask/look around for more info on this (I am probably wrong). If you want a more realistic feel I will suggest this P90.
I left out Echo1 and KS because they are the same gun, and although they are cheap, their quality overall is decent, not as good as the top three though. They are however very cheap so I would suggest you upgrade them upon buying one if you do, it would only be $150ish more and then you would have a way better running gun then its stock self.
Like I said though its all-personal preferences, a lot of people will agree/disagree with my statement, that's why it is just my opinion on the matter. I personally did not buy any of the three listed, I bought a KS from the classified and invested quite a bit on upgrades.
Hope this review guide was helpful, if you have any questions, just send me a PM and I will try to answer you asap.
Now below are the parts (internal and external) I have fitted onto my gun.
KS P90 (Own both TR and RDS versions)
Shoots a consistent 400 FPS with .20s (as of Dec 22nd 2012)
Shoots a consistent 380 FPS with .20s (as of Dec 10th 2013)
Shoots a consistent 350 FPS with .20s (as of Dec 28th 2013)
All upgrades were done by Mckee and The_Silencer, the All Mighty Kings are gun docing.
*FOR OTHER P90 REVIEWS CLICK THE LINKS BELOW:
Last edited by Short Round; September 21st, 2014 at 22:01..
|November 7th, 2010, 20:41||#2|
I have updated my review into a mid size overview of P90's ingeneral from magazine quality to attachments and such.
Hope it helps.
Feel free to post anything I missed below. I know forsure I missed topics like the hop up unit, specifics on the gearbox internals and much more but I am too lazy to update right now.
|November 7th, 2010, 21:28||#3|
Join Date: Jul 2009
As a fellow P90 user I'll add in my 2 cents on my Echo1 P90:
Internally they're shit TBH. My piston stripped less than 300 rounds in, the piston head cracked, the bevel gear chipped, the pinion gear chipped, the hopup does not maintain its setting, and the brass bushings are overly soft. The tappet plate will mostly likely break if the gearbox is opened when the spring is under pressure, so beware. The 9.6v battery that came with it died but that's not really a fault of the gun. As well, the motor height is adjusted on the back of the motor cage via a hex wrench. Chinese p90 gearboxes are made out of softish metal and the motor cage will break if overadjusted. Replace with a TM motor cage if possible. The fire selector cutoff is prone to wearing out on all models.
As for good things, the stock sector and spur gear have yet to fail me, even under extreme (35+ rps) conditions. The wiring assembly is located on the outside so it's a cinch to do stuff like install MOSFETS. Due to the design, the P90 has the shortest length inner barrel of all the bullpup guns, about 247mm, or the same length as a G36Cs.
Due to the mag design, reloading is cumbersome and slow compared to an mp5 or m4. This can be a turnoff for some. Speaking of mags, avoid MAG brand magazines, especially if you have a Chinese P90. I bought 4 and only one feeds well on semi auto. Apparently some people who run CA and TM P90s have no issues with them but YMWV. I have no issues with Silverback or Pro-arms mags but hicaps are crap for me.
As someone who's 5'11, I have no issues with holding it, I'm perfectly comfortable. As well, mags are not conducive to speed loading so this may be a major drawback in a CQB environment. If you're planning on getting a Chinese P90 over a Classic Army or Tokyo Marui, then be prepared to spend $150+ on getting the internals up to par.
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it - Aristotle
-Founder of Steel City Hamilton Infantry and Tactics
-Certified level 43 Autosniper by Commander Amos
|August 16th, 2011, 03:25||#6|
So a little update, since its 3am and I am still awake I decided to update this thread a little since there were some mistakes I made from my previous update.
FIRST OFF (thank you The_Silencer for your gun doc work) I cannot thank you enough Linh.
You pretty much took a beat up gun and made it into gold (Systema worthy).
He's done so much awesome miracle work on my gun, I find it hard to believe this thing had every single problem in the book only a couple months ago.
My P90 is still going strong. I think its 3 years old now.
That is pretty much it looks like currently.
For the most part there are no stock parts in it anymore and it is hitting a nice consistent 335FPS with a very nice trigger response.
Finally bought a P90 Dump Pouch from thevestguy for $80ish bucks (on sale $5 off I think) and FINALLY got around to buying a Lipo (well I bought one before, tried putting deans on it and killed it so I bought a replacement with an adapter)
Overall I am still satisfied with my P90. Its the only gun I own and I plan on keeping it that way, well at least as a primary.
If you are in the market for a P90 currently, I suggest you hit up the AV retailer section and classifieds. Since I got my P90, prices for them have dropped drastically and TM P90's are popping up left and right
On top of that there are new P90's so get that Visa out and prepare to start swiping.
MY ADVICE: BUY BUY BUY
Last edited by Short Round; August 16th, 2011 at 03:34..
|December 20th, 2011, 02:24||#7|
Recently acquired a King Arms QD SP90 Silencer with Flashhider and calculated that the best suitable extended inner barrel to use with the silencer.
For those who are wondering/for future reference here it is.
A 407mm barrel will be flush with a HK Pro Silencer (155mm) when installed on the gun (P90).
The barrel you want to be using with the King Arms SP90 Silencer is a 430mm one in length.
Now I know that majority of you would probably say, a standard 247 length or any other shorter length barrel (363mm for example) would still work with the silencer and this is true, however I found that in my case, the bb's were hitting the inside of my silencer/I want the increased accuracy and range for outdoor play.
Anyways hope this will help, I have yet to see anyone post something like this on the internet, so here it is.
Last edited by Short Round; April 28th, 2012 at 13:20..
|December 20th, 2011, 09:41||#8|
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Anola(ish) MB
Sadly you reviews a used ks. I'd love to know how good it is out of the box
Eddie Creek, MB Airsoft Field, Valken Dealer, Local Age Verification
|December 20th, 2011, 09:59||#9|
I will add that the CA P90's battery compartment is just a tiny bit shorter in height than the TM p90. My 11.1v lipo from hobbyking fits tightly into the TM but will not fit in the CA. The depth and width are no problem, but the height seems to be anywhere from .5mm to 1mm shorter.
|December 20th, 2011, 10:39||#10|
|December 20th, 2011, 15:40||#11|
this is the one I have that doesn't fit.
The mold of the right half of the body also has the bottom of the battery chamber slightly tilted up so it takes a bit of space away, but I think it's still a bit smaller than the TM chamber.
|January 4th, 2012, 02:28||#12|
|January 4th, 2012, 09:59||#13|
the body is the same black body, the upper receiver is the restricted part on the p90... I think it's just a bad cast, possibly the mold was pulled right off the TM version as the texture across the body is not uniform, it's bordering smoother/shiny on some parts where the rest is matte and texturized. Though it could also be from temperature variation when the mold was injected with plastic to create the half, I think I read somewhere that too hot or too cold can produce shiny vs matte look.
The material of the body is definitely not the same as the TM one, the TM body seems a bit softer and more flexible, while the CA is harder and feels more brittle. Since this is a brand new gun though, I can't say whether they've changed anything from older models of CAp90, and the TM I have is a frankengun that still refuses to work properly.
Fit and finish even on the old TM frankengun parts are definitely better than CA The front end of the CA body has some creak and twist, while the TM is solid.
Last edited by lurkingknight; January 4th, 2012 at 10:02..
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