Airsoft Canada - Gearbox Grease

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- - Gearbox Grease (https://airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=120778)

You can get a lifetime supply sized tube of silicone grease at a car parts place. It's used on brake caliper pins.

I vote for ARS sticky-g silicone grease and ARS molybenum gear grease, Ive used them in a few builds already and im convinced :D.

Was surprised that I couldn't find a thread about grease. I would have thought it would be a major topic in regard to gun maintenance.

Now I've seen siliCON and siliCONE grease mentioned :confused:

I believe what you want is siliCONE (IIRC it's the one that's "synthetic" right?) the other one (silicon) is used as a conductor, ie. like in computers )semi-conductors), after all that's why they call it Silicon Valley right. Silicone is used in industry as a lubricant.

PS: Use the FinishLine teflon grease and be done with it. Another user on Arnies highly recommends it over White Lithium.

Quote:

After discussing in another thread how low my opinion is of Lithium grease, I now have concrete evidence of how rubbish it is.

First off, the Lithium in the grease, offers no lubrication properties, its simply used as a thickener.

Well, my Classic Army G36 was acting up the other day, running very poorly, sounded strange, strained. I had not used it in nearly a year. I tried to chrono the gun but the shots were sounding so bad, I put it away and took it apart a few days later (today)

Well, first thing I found was that the grease had become very tacky and sticky. It looked like month old mayonase was dried on every part of the gun. It was a struggle to pull the piston out of the cylinder (by hand). Not thanks to a great air seal either. It was crumbly, tacky and where it was on the gears, the gears could barely move. It was like glue in the gun.

I cleaned all the internals and gears etc. Gave the shimming a check. Fitted a nice new bearing spring guide. Put a couple of drops of silicone oil on the O ring and a couple of drops in the cylinder. Used my finger and moved it around. No sign of damage or wear to any of the parts, which is to be expected as this gun has had very little use.

Re greased with ceramic Teflon grease (I perhaps used a bit too much) and put the gun back together again.

Pulled the trigger and the motor could barely turn the box over, it ran better than before but it sounded terrible. I tried a different motor and POW! The mechbox jumped back to life and after adjusting the motor hight, the box is sounding great. I used a 5SKU torque motor (only spare one I had). The Classic Army motor is stuffed. Its got no power any more. I am convinced after what I saw in the mechbox that the horrible Lithium ###### killed my motor. It was so sticky and tacky, I think it would have strained any motor and drained batteries very quickly. For the record I was testing with a 7.4v 2200mah 25c Lipo at full charge and a fully charged 1500mah 9.6v stick type NiMH.

Those stock CA motors are a bit slow and a bit noisy but they have more torque than a TM EG1000 though they are slower. There is no way this motor would have struggled in a 350fps set up with a motor like this. Unless the motor was a bad one or something else was wrong. I have as they say, seen with my own eyes what Lithium does to mechboxes.

Avoid this rubbish!

My concern now is I have a Classic Army SCAR H and if it has this same rubbish Lithium grease in it, will it suffer the same fate? Am I going to have to open up that mechbox and sort that as well? Not at all impressed. I guess, I am going to have to open the SCAR H and do some preventative work. Otherwise its going to nag at me.

So, please can we stop telling people to use Lithium grease in guns?

Grease 101
Greases comprise of 2 elements. The base oil and the thickener. The base oil is the lubricant and the thickener or "soap", is what holds it in place so the oil can do its job.
NLGI rating is the rating given to grease according to the thickness.
Viscosity is the base oil's resistance to flow.
I will use vehicles because it something everybody can relate to. Vet and NooB.
Now most vehicles will take a NLGI 2. Viscosity ISO 220 grease. The Soaps for this application usually use of a lithium soap. As parts start to wear out, you may use a NLGI 2, Viscosity ISO 460. The movement of the parts used for this grease is minimal. ball joints, wheel bearings (which are considered a slow speed bearing) Spring shackles etc.
The higher the rate of travel the lower the NLGI rating you will want.
Eg: your engine could never take grease because it would push the grease to the walls and the base oil with it. You want something that will flow back down and have the ability to get pump back through the engine. It should have the ability to splash lubricate as well.

With that, viscosity will change with temp. Hot oil runs faster than cold oil. The viscosity will change from ISO 3000 (almost solid) at -30c to ISO 35 (like water) at 100c.
Airsoft GB's will never reach these limits, however it still changes.

In an Airsoft GB, there are multiple speeds. The fastest being the motor and the slowest being the sector gear. The piston, due to its travel length and surface area is higher in friction coefficient. Any grease with a NLGI 1 rating or higher would be too much. I would recommend a NLGI 0 or 00 rating. A lubricant made with a pure base oil would be ideal.

I actually use treadmill silicone. Its pure, no damage to rubber or plastic parts. Has excellent stability and viscosity.
Note: I wouldn't use silicone if you have a silicone hop up bucking. Silicone lube is not compatible with silicone materials.

This link in Wikipedia will help understand the conductivity of Silicone.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dielectric
It also has excellent Water repelling qualities.

Here are a couple of compatibility charts for Soaps, Base oils and Lube vs seals.

http://www.airesoft.net/Airesoft-Lubrication.htm

Riker,

I laud you for this! Repeatedly, I have attempted to preach the merits of 100% GE Silicone.

I personally use Centistoke levels of 3500 and up of pure GE silicone. I'll use high cst for my gearbox, doesn't fling off the gears, cushions the gears very well, and further reduces gearbox noise and wear. The aforementioned along with proper shimming of course.

I also use lighter weights for sealing my cylinder head, a medium weight over the cylinder head brass nozzle before I slip on the airseal nozzle and then do a compression test, I smile every time.

Film quality is great, if applied in proper amounts and proper weights, it will not dry out and I'm beginning to find it to be a total solution for my airsoft needs, this, despite my love for Graphite spray on lube...

Cst is actually a better term and usage for Airsoft GB's.
At least you don't have any cross contamination using silicone throughout.
By the way, thats what I do.
I'm a Machinery Lubrication Technician 1 with ICML.
PS. Spray lubes should never be used, unless it's down the barrel.

Airsoft barrels should never be lubed!

It negates the hop-up effect!

Everything else being said is spot on though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riker (Post 1432417)

PS. Spray lubes should never be used, unless it's down the barrel.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amos (Post 1432492)

Airsoft barrels should never be lubed!

Uh-oh.

for your gears you want a very sticky grease. for axles you want a bearing grease.

I've been using lithium grease for the last 10 years and everything is in perfect working order

If it works for you, definitely keep doing it. I by no means want to change your mind or sell you anything. This is simply for you to make up your mind. I personally like silicone, thats my opinion.
PS: I only use lube in the barrel as a cleaner and I never use spray.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitchell12 (Post 1433845)

Anal lube.

Ironically enough, I have used this for an airsoft gun before. It's good stuff, but far more expensive that the stuff that has already been suggested. Cheaper to go the hardware route.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vondnik (Post 1432972)

I've been using lithium grease for the last 10 years and everything is in perfect working order

That guy's problem was that he was using a Classic Army AEG and you can expect the motor to be useless and weak if it is a CA model.