KJW M4 vs WE M4/M16 GBBR?
 

So I'm interested in purchasing a GBBR this summer (July/August) and I was wondering which one will better suite me?

I'm currently looking at the KJW/Tanio Koba m4 GBBR (Mod to M16 frontset or extend the stock barrel) or the WETT AWSS M16A3 Gen 3 GBBR.

Here is a list of stuff I would really like to have:
-Reliability (10,000 rounds+ a month with moderate maintenance)
-Gas efficiency
-Decent performance in cold temperatures (about 5*C give or take)
-Ease of upgrades, both internal and external
-Easy to maintain
-Really good hop-up (aftermarket included)
-Ability to install an SCS Concave Spacer or something of the like
-Ability to install at least a 6.03 509mm+ tightbore barrel
-Ability to adjust FPS (I know it's available for both platforms, but which one is easier to use?)
-Price is around $400-800 without upgrades (a LITTLE flexible)

So far, I've read countless of positive reviews and feedback of the KJW/TK M4 GBBR and I'm definitely leaning more towards it. The WE GBBRs however, have received quite a mix of reviews and user comments. The WE SCAR GBBRs looks and sound nice, but from the mix of comments I've read, I'm concerned with the reliability of the gun. I would love to get the WE M16 GBBR, but I haven't heard anything about that gun.

With that in mind, I am definitely open to other suggestions of GBBRs. It doesn't have to be limited to an M4/M16 variant. A bulpup GBBR would be the shit, but I doubt I'd be seeing one anytime soon. Also, anyone know if KWA plans to intergrate the NS2/System 7 platform into GBBRs anytime soon?

Any input would be highly appreciated! Thanks everyone :D

I've seen all of them gamed and the only one I could recommend for performance is the KJW.

Its really gas efficient even with a CQBR barrel. If you ran a longer barrel and adjusted the power down it would be even more efficient.
The couple I've seen could do 2 50rd mags on a single gas charge in 10-15c weather. Both functioned down to 6-7c with little change.

You do have to take the bolt out to do velocity adjustment, I'm not sure how that compares to the WE. The adjustment itself is with shims so it's really consistent at a given temp.

Best recommendation is to read the 9 page thread on the KJW here. There are proponents on both systems (and the WA) but the only person I've known who has owned all 3 is now running only the KJW.

-Grant

I owned a WE M16A3 and it's by the far the best and most impressive gun I had (personnal opinion here), it look bad ass and is a must for long weapon lover. Exact same reliability as the M4A1. I would by another one if it wasn't of the availabitlity and price of it.

My vote is for WE. On the surface, the KJW is a solid gun. But WE has been around longer, has easier to find parts, and is ultimately cheaper than the KJW.

Prometheus, Nineball all the FF companies will be making aftermarket parts for the KJ shortly :)

rounds
 

I have put around 5 grand thought my kjw and it is still factory and running great best buy I have ever made

How many rounds have you put through the gun so far?

Wait what? You put 5 grand on the M4 but it's still factory stock?

5 grand... is most likely a strange use of the term referring to round count.

There's reports of the KJ ones going for well over 10,000 rounds before needing maintenance...

and with the 30 round mags that's well over 300 mag changes...

These are pretty awesome guns :)

5 grand = 5,000 rounds through......not "thought"

*Amos beat me

Hehe, I'd be I would go over 5000 rounds a month at least. When I first got my AEG, I couldn't stop shooting it. Then came my pistol, which I broken within a month, then when the GBBR rolls in... :rolleyes:

I haven't owned a WE M4, but I had a WE scar and I fired it ALOT, but the outcome of that is it would never last for more than a week of good plinking before it broke down and I needed to replace another part, with my KJW, you buy the cradle velocity reducer and the piston, get an old tire inner tube to replace broken rubber bands with, and you're set for life

I've owned an AGM M4 (WA based system), a WE M4, a WE SCAR, and a KJW M4. I now only have the KJW M4, the others have all gone to new homes. While the AGM had the most realistic operation, and the WEs had nice bodies with nicely engraved trades, the KJW actually WORKS! No jamming, consistant hop-up and velocity. There aren't many upgrade parts available, but you don't need to upgrade much. This one works, and works properly, right out of the box. A few parts and it goes from great to bulletproof. Get the Cradle Airsoft piston, velocity reducer, and tightbore, and you are set.

KJ for the win. Have owed mine since they first mailed me the first prototype (before actual release date). Very reliable, it just KEEPS WORKING, unlike any of the other brands out there.

Keep in mind that the WE types do not have a real open bolt, while the KJ does.

Ken

True.

KJW's blowback is entirely dependent on an elastic band. :)

Actually the Open Bolt system is available now for the PDW and the conversion for the Scar and Armalites is coming very soon.

I have a WE m4 GBB and it is awesome. I bought both co2 and green gas (propane) magazine to find out which one is better. I tuned my laser and scope with propane one first, but then it's not that accurate when I switchted to co2. They are both using .20g and testing range is around 60 feet. Co2 gives more power but it's hard to refill especially when u try to get the co2 bottle out. The gun itself is simply awesome. The only concern is that the realistic-ish noise that it makes could freak out ur neighbours and it's quite loud. Hope this helps

That makes it an upgrade whereas the KJW has that from the factory. My buddy has the WE and it looks and feels awesome. As far as reliability goes, he's had some problems with it jamming and locking up completely. My KJW was used but with only cosmetic upgrades until I picked it up. I through in the Cradle parts but I still would like to get a tightbore for it. Th e biggest benefit of the KJ is also the weakest point for me. The mags are gas efficient. I have been running three loads on one gas fill with consistency. The problem is that the mags are Thermold style which means that I can't run two in my double mag pouches as they tend to grab each other as I try to pull one out. That bothers me quite a bit as it forces me to have to "bulk up" my vest with more pouches. That being said, I would still take the KJ over the WE.

Whilst true yes...they are being produced with the open bolt system now (pdw) and the M4 and scar are coming down the pipe. They will be offering the open bolt to those that want to change their brass tube system.

They have the conversion kit out for the PDW, so I'm sure they would make it for the SCAR and M4's as well.

I've owned a WE SCAR and an M4, ran both stock at first and in one session on the M4 put close to 1,000 rounds through it, not one single failure of any kind. Threw in the RA Tech NPAS and still had zero problems. This was on a brand new V.3 straight out of the box.

Never seen the KJW, but don't discount WE guns either. In my experience, they're tanks.

I did quiet a bit of research before I picked which system to go with and frankly I found the WE System to be the one that was consistently reliable as of their current iterations, earlier issues with the system seem to have been growing pains for the company and as their QC has improved considerably and they are committed to producing quality product.

I sided with WE (specifically the SCAR) and I feel I made the right purchase, I guess time will tell.


Cheers

I traded my heavily upgraded WE SCAR for a stock KJW M4, and I have NEVER been happier, that WE was a pile of crap IMO

it didnt break because it was upgraded, it was upgraded because all the stock parts broke

I don't think you are a typical user... as you seem to break everything you touch.. and do weird juryrigs to get things going again that result in further breaking..

I have 2 scars a M4 and the PDW .. and they have all worked without issues .. more reliable than most AEGs..

One Scar is down with a sheared valve body.. after pretty heavy use.. the fix is easy and with an upgraded part.. should be long lasting..

To get the best performance from these guns.. use high quality bbs of .28 weight or heavier.. Bastards feed flawlessly.

my WE is still going strong, and its a version 1! just broke the charging handle actually, but that was a well known problem with the V1s (now fixed).
i have no idea how many rounds she has, but damn. its a V1. it was made over a year ago . no upgrades, no mods, nothing. if thats not the definition of a tank, i dunno what is.
if you like to tinker, clean and maintain, and generally work on your gun, then go WE.
if you want to pull it out of the closet, play a game, then put it away till the next game, go KJW. thats not to say that the WE is high maintenance, or that the KJW is maintenance free, thats just a general conclusion iv come to after about a year of reading about both systems.
if you want real steel accessories/furniture, go WE. no system can beat it for that. off the top of my head it is 100% real steel compatible with everything from the buffer tube back, the buffer and spring, the pistol grip, mag release, and rail are all drop in replaceable for RS parts. they can even use RS charging handle with a simple mod or use RS mag shells (pmag for example) with some sanding and filing. not sure about KJW/RS compatibility, though i think that system went the other way and is more AEG compatible (aka cheaper).
as for aftermarket, WE wins. the only real after market manufacturer for KJW is cradle. all this stuff about Prometheus, Ninebal, etc is all talk as far as i know and no actual parts have been made available. WE on the other hand has RA-Tech, TSC (not very good admittedly), stinger, and PMC. im probably missing a few but such is life.
in the end, determine your needs, do your research and make a choice that you are comfortable with. you wont be disappointed.

QFT

I think it needs to be noted that GBBR's are not for everyone, they require more attention and need to be regularly maintained to ensure they last. As well parts will break eventually, hell parts break on real rifles.


Also I don't know you personally Nooblord but frankly from what Ive read of your posts I would say that you should probably be the last person to gauge the reliability of anything. You seem to be cursed or something.


Also I seem to remember you talking about your KJW M4 being broken recently? You might have wanted to mention that.

KJW M4 broken IE rubber band broke, thats nothing, thats like a wire disconnecting in an AEG, thats hardly something to write home about... and it takes literally 30 seconds to make and install a replacement

otherwise, I have never broken a TM hicappa, I havent broken any AEGs from what I can remember, its just the clone shit and the WE shit that I break, oh and the TM 5-7, but like the KJW piston cup in the M4, the 5-7 was design flaw

off topic much?

Both systems have their pros and cons. I find that as long as the WE is lubed properly, it works well. It is way more realistic in look and feel the KJ. That being said. I still like my KJW over the WE. That may be chalked up to the fact that I own the KJ and my buddy owns the WE. If it was the other way around, perhaps my view would be oposite. They are both good platforms. I have not come across any airsoft or real steel for that matter that is perfect in every way.

Explain how a KJW breaking off topic?

Go with a WE - you won't be disappointed.

more the topic of everything I touch breaking, thats OT

QFT

I was merely posting the other relevant info as a backdrop for your advice considering that you inadvertently omitted that your rifle had a key part break in a short time of ownership. Even if its a quick fix and is cheap (arguably the SCAR hing plate is both cheap and easy to fix. as well) it still failed within an unacceptable time frame then again your mileage might vary.

In anycase no hard feelings as I said I don't personally know you and thus I cannot judge your maintenance skills, so I will chalk up your experience as bad luck.


And El Cactus Loco's point of lack of availability of aftermarket parts for the KJW is one of the reasons why I chose the WE. Good point and should factor into your decision.

-----^

+ Parts are EASILY available from KJW :)

Touche...


However until aftermarket parts come out the market is still bare save for oem stuff.

The KJ's are designed by Tanio Koboyashi...

The Japanese tuner market tends to favor "home grown" designs (See: TM upgrades vs KSC upgrades)

There's gonna be some pretty cool stuff out in a few months... I just hope KJ buys the designs to the AK74U Mr. Koboyashi was showing off a while ago..

Agreed, My wife absolutely loves the GHK AKS74U GBBR but Im not sold on its merits yet. If KJW/WE made one I'd jump all over it. But I guess thats abit off topic.


In all honesty I will concede that the Mags for KJW are superior by all accounts when properly maintained. And once the aftermarket stuff starts showing up they will be fairly even in terms of reliability.

Time will tell.

Yea.. the GHK system is pretty awful :(

Bunch of fragile parts built on a pretty crappy base gun...

If you're going GHK you MUST buy the RATECH upgrades otherwise you'll have a nice wall hanger.

Thanks guys, I'm pretty sure I'll go with the KJW now :)

Now, if only I can find a full metal/black one in the classifieds >.>

just checked the open bolt system for WE. they still looks so fake...you will know what I was talking about when you see the spring through the bolt window.

I personally like the system as it is now, it works well. I painted the brass tube black..it just disappeared.

WE brass tube
 

I don't care about the brass tube... in my opinion that flash of brass looks great as the gun cycles.

also .. for me.. it is about performance.. I want a solid gun that works when I need it to.. I don't much care how the internals work.. as long as they do.

If I want the open breach... look.. and feel... I can always go RS .. grab a gun and head to the range.

^^fully agreed

stoked with my WE PDW which is basically the same platform as the M4.

Brass tube, like its been reviewd before, actually looks like a bullet entering the chamber. I honestly don't know why people dislike it so much, plus its a very reliable system.

I was at first myself considering a KJW M4, but at that time is was still new to the market and no AM parts existed...plus couldn't come across an all black version in country. and i know the mags are good, but i like the WE mags better for their look (personnal preference, not objective at all)

Have you handled both? you should, handling a gun is without a single doubt the most effective way to know if it's right for you. I was myself asking for advice at first on here, and came to realize that you get half the people to tell you to go for it, and the other half telling you you would be nuts to do so. shopped myself instead, and next thing you know i was going for a PDW, not even an M4. so yeah. go shopping budd.

yeah it depends on how you handle it. I own a KJW until now I'm very satisfied with it.

It's too bad you will rarely find KJW metal lowers. As for WE metal ones, you can get. That's IF you get the cansoft versions.

Lanny, I'll be talking to you tonight about those metal lowers.....