Certified? huh..
 

Ok i don't get it. whats this Ba certified thing or whatever it is.. do you need to be certified to use this at a range or to play....?

thanks..

certain fields require you to have a sniper certification in order to use a "hot" sniper rifle due to the fps being above 450.

Oh ok cool. cause there is no way id sit down for a lecture. Guess i'll scratch getting a sniper rifle next.

but for anything else its good. good to hear.

Thanks

the sniper clinics consist of movement, ghillies, Minimum Engagement Distances (MED), etc..
something to look into.

and if this is your first gun, a sniper rifle is never a good idea

BA (bolt action) if you don't have that you can only use your riffle at the same power as AEG's...

Many places will also limit the minimum engagement range to about a 70 feet with a hot gun and force you to engage with your secondary weapon or make 2 man team mandatory were your spotter engages clauser targets

Cheers

Ps lets be honest, sniping is NOT for everyone... just building a reliable precise BA can be an extremely frustrating experiance... ask around... plus costs are a lot more then most people immagine at first ((Ba and equipment))

((70 .. 100 was typ so I was wrong anyway FOX thanks for clarifying)

There is no such things are 100fts minimum engagement distances, unless you are shooting way abover the usual field limit, even with the certified sniper limits.

Someone made that MED out of nothing and it propagated like fire.
A typical MED for a sniper rifle at 450fps is 40 feets.

To have a MED of 100 feets, your rifle would be shooting at 625fps.

Standard sniper limits is 450fps (MED 40fts)
Lvl2 snipers are limited to 500fps. (MED 55fts)
Lvl3 snipers are limited to 550fps. (MED 65fts)

MED are calculated to have 1joule at impact.

oh yeah for sure.. i was just wondering what it was. I just get enough lecturing in the military so, for a hobby i have no intentions of sitting threw more if i dont have to.

As for the sniper rifle, i have an actual M24 at home. i just thought it would be fun to get a Airsoft of the same one. but maybe later.. and costs related, its alot cheaper than when i buy real amo and shoot off a couple hundred .. so Airsoft is a nice (cheaper) alternative and i can shoot on my property. :)

Frak... 65 feet @550
 

Does velocity really drop a 100 fps in 25 feet?

Ummm, no. Minimum engagement for me is 60ft and I focus on hitting a vest, pouches, etc. And this is with my rifle shooting 0.20g BBs at 400fps. I don't agree with the MEDs Fox posted up, I think they are typos, because none of us certified snipers would have those short engagements....... unless we were trying to keep up in the Phillipines anyways.

makes sense.

But like fox said, i also read something about zero engage till 100ft.. weird. but i assume stalker knows more as hes certified for it..:snipe: :cheers: so no worries. I guess their is so much talk on the net that its hard to find and keep all the rules straight. I have a hard time finding alot of actual info.. so i just ask on here cause, people reply way faster and its easier.

Generally it's a respect thing, I wouldn't want to get shot by my M24 at 100ft with the 0.36g BBs I use either, so I am careful about who I shoot where and at what distance. Fox_111 is certified as well, and sometimes holds the Quebec courses, so he's worth listening to as well. I just don't agree with the distances he laid out, all will make you bleed if the BB hits lightly covered skin. Is why I mentioned it being a typo.

Yes. I agree with stalker here. I wouldn't want to be shot by a level 2 rifle at under 100ft. 70ft is way too close. Even 100ft is too close. (except for close friends or CO's ;) ) I wouldn't even bother centering my scope at that range as I'd be grabbing for my mk23 socom.

As with stalker, I'll always try to aim for kit keeping it well below the neck and face in the even of a flyer. Mags are great because the target won't feel it as pain but everyone will hear it hit. Dump pouches hanging over people asses are great spots too! I've even put a few shots on peoples boots in which they hated that I hit them there but thankful I didn't aim for the fleshy inner thigh I sometimes do with a lower fps AEG. lol.

The MEDs are calculated to have 1joule at impact. That is the same feeling as putting your hand right on the musle of a 280fps AEG and shooting it. It hurt like hell. It will leave a mark, but should not break the skin.

Those MEDs are a standard of safety. 1joule was calculated to be about the maximum energy the skin can sustain before breaking. (leaving out sensitives parts like the face...)

The sniper clinic then teach how to safely use those MEDs in the context of a game. Like stalker said, shooting someone right on the MED is not somemething a certified sniper will do. But knowing the effect of his shot, he can take apropriate mesures to make a safe shot on a player.

Since the sniper clinic primaraly focus on safety and airsoft ballistic, it's something all certified snipers are tested on and are trusted to be safe with.

I guess I wanted to safe time and explanations by posting the base value only. But they have to be used in context and knowledge. Like the speed limits on the road. You might be allowed to drive at 100km/h, but if it's icy, you won't be doing so.

oh for sure, i wouldent want to get hit by one at close range either. makes a lot of sense.

Are their any outdoor ranges or something, most ive seen are just basic skid made courses. these do not look like fun. specially to snipe from.. I have a 40 acre property so me and my friends snipe and shoot outdoors all the time.. good to know the distance tho.

makes sense, not everyone knows the damage an airsoft can do.. maybe it would actually be interesting to learn and get some tips on how the rifle works etc.. but i would feel better at a range for "sure" with someone who is well versed with the weapon so i dont get hurt..

good info cheers,

I have a graphic somewhere that show the fps drop at certain distances. I can't find it right now.

But based on my memory, to a certain point yes. The numbers I have and the formula used to calculate the MED take into account the benchmark fps (with 0.20g), BB weight, terminal velocity (air friction at sea level, 20 celcius).

MEDs are given for the optimal BB weight too. That might play witht the final number if you try to calculate it yourself. BB used range from 0.29g to 0.36g depending on fps. When we say a 450fps rifle, we should really say a 1.88j rifle.
That leave out the usual misunderstanding of the modified fps based on BB weight.

This complicated thing is covered in my sniper clinic and it's all explained in my documentation. I'm positive that it's also the case in the other sniper clinics in Canada.

fyi airsoft weapons are not the best for target shooting.

A pellet/bb gun would be much better.

yeah i noticed with my m4, i hit a few perfect shots then the rest just go around it.. weird..

With my pellet rifle, I could hit flies landing on my targets. Much more fun than shooting an airsoft rifle on paper target.

I've actually been considering a pellet rifle to replace my shooting fun, just have to 'justify it' with myself, and consider where and how often I could use it. Sure, I could play with it in my girlfriend's backyard, the neighbours wouldn't mind............. lol, seriously, I used to hunt with them over 20 years ago, now I avoid killing anything but mosquitos, blackflies and worms (for fishing)........... I'd kill a turkey though, they are ugly enough that God meant for them to be killed......... but still, justifying the expense for a couple month craving, only to collect dust afterwards.....

I used to be really into pellet guns. At one point, I had 3. I was shooting everyday with some friends and my brother.

I did kill a LOT of birds and other animals. It was wrong, but that experiance served a purpose.

I too was considering buying a new one. A serious air rifle. Something I could hunt with. I even joined the ASC equivalent for air guns. One day I will make the move back. When I have a place to shoot.

Last time I shot an air rifle, was at my friend cottage. I'm glad to report that I'm still very effective. I have this gift with any shooting thing... Even a garden hose because a precision weapon in my hands. Hahaha!

For MEDs, I use "mile markers," and what that is for me as a sniper, I know what will happen at a certain point based on the terrain. Basically, theyre pieces of nature that I know my stride count is to, such as a small mound for cover, if im at say 40 strides away, I know that is about 120-125 feet, well within my mental MED. Or if a tree with branches falling off is at 20 strides, Id be reaching for my secondary/sidearm, just in case. It's a strategy employed by US Marine Sniper School as a judgement of distance, forgot what they call it however

And how much does this cert cost?

Check out the CZ air guns. My slavia 630 is amazing accurate and ranks up there for best purchases ever.

Granted, yeah, I don't use it anymore. It just sits in a gun case all the time.

Depending on the field used and the material provided, around the same cost as a game.

What do you think of my methods FOX :D

Number of football fields laid end to end..... assuming all qualified snipers used to play football in school. Lol

I use a similar trick, except I pace out toe-to-heel (12" boot soles) the distance between things I see every day, and memorize the amount of ground between me and them regularly. Within 150ft it's easy to get about +/-10ft away, past that it becomes +/-20ft out to 300ft.

Fox has a system set up using mildots and his calculator, my trick I don't even have to use a finger to short out how far to a target, if i shot a guy with a pistol or a piece of chewed gum, I can tell you how far away he was and have it measured.

It's good, but I prefer a more reliable method.
I teach how to mesure distance with your hand size relative to your target. Granted you know the estimated size of your target.
The same thing using a scope. Duplex or Mildot scopes.

Also, I talk about the effect of lighting, elevation and other factors that could play with optical range estimation.

My students will try these techniques and get used to them. 2 very important one are acuratly estimating (contradiction, yet it's true) our MED using both our scope and hand. Also, a 6' tall person will usually mesure 3 or 4 fingers high at 100 feets.

When you are in the wood, laying on the ground, things can seam well away or much closer. Having those dependable ways of mesuring distance will greatly improve your range estimation.

Oh yeah I know, i also figure in the wind, since I usually firing so that "gush" of wind will cover up my silenced sniper rifle being shot, as well as carry the BB (may seem useless to you, but has helped many times for me).

@CDN_Stalker or you just your carpte of BB bastards to guesstimate the shot :D
But in all seriousness, thats how i found the length of my stride. I wear size 13 boots, which is about 12. 625 inches, which multiplying by 3 (length of stride) gives you about a meter. And I did use a football field at first, since I played the sport in high school, as the QB

@FOX_111 I dont use fingers, I instead use the "mile markers" i was talking about since they too will be at 15 foot distances, so if someone is about 3-4 inches tall next to the 7th "mile marker" which is +/- 105 feet. I do use the mil dots on the scope as well, thats usually how I place the "markers"


But then again, I apply real steel sniping methods to airsoft, yours is cemented in the sport, so its why its more reliable to you

Actually, it's real sniping methods adapted to the sport. Most of it I learned in my military books collection and practiced on the field. My whole clinic is based on a compressed sniper qualification course. Compressed a lot, since I have to do in 6-8 houres what they do in several days.

Your technique might be good. But I want the method to be as simple and effective for anyone. A lot of the student have no military background and less than 2 years of game experiance.

Well several years for me, but that was strictly real steel. Ive tried to adapt it to airsoft, but you seem to have done a far better job