C1A1/C2A1 Rifle
 

Hi,

I am just interested in learning the differences between a regular FAL vs the Canadian C1A1 rifle, as well as the steps and parts required to convert a say... KA FAL into a C1A1.

To my understanding, the differences between a FAL and L1A1 are the metric vs imperial measurements. In addition, C1A1 uses a Canadian disk rear sight instead of the one on the L1A1. There are no sand cuts on the breech block, and all the furniture including the carrying handle are made of wood. Also, I heard C1A1 has a stripper clip guide, any idea on what that is? And C1A1 is also only semi-auto right?

Not sure which would require more money and work, C1A1 or C7A1...

Fuck, seriously, as with every other question you've felt the need to ask, in less than a minute, I found the answer. Learn to use google.

Since you're too retarded to do your own searches though, "open wide, here comes the airplane!"
C1A1
http://www.eme421.com/FNC1A1.html
http://www.milsurps.com/content.php?...A1-vs.-FN-C1A1
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_FAL#...h_pattern_FALs

L1A1
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L1A1_Self-Loading_Rifle

FN FAL
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_FAL


EDIT: As far as turning an airsoft FAL into a C1, your MAIN challenge, other than trades, will be wood furnature. As far as trades go, unless you can get a bank lower, you're out of luck I think

Yeah, I spent like 2 hours last night trying to do searches on the C1A1 rifle, and I couldn't find shit on Wikipedia or WorldGuns. Only place I found relevant information was imbdf. I even discussed my searches with Ken about the limited info that I found. Look, maybe you fed better terms than me on Google, or found better places to look. Who knows, but please, keep the attitude to a minimum.

Edit: To be precise, I did find shit, the shit I posted on my first post. But aside from that, nothing else I could follow up on, hence this thread.

That's the information that I needed. Thank you for giving me a straight answer. I would've appreciated it even more without the attitude.

Have a good day.

Seems like I also have to modify the dust cover in addition to getting a rear sight. Not sure if the Canadian rear sight would fit without any modifications.

There's also the arctic trigger guard, a trigger guard that folds into a slot inside the pistol grip for use with gloves. Yeah, I don't think that can be done without a machinist.

Now I have never fired an FAL before, but I am assuming your statement about the main challenge being finding wooden furniture would be only partially correct based on these facts. Trigger guard modifications, finding a rear sight ($100-$250 from last night's research), dust cover modifications(or finding a real steel dust cover), finding a blank lower, seems like this project would be out of reach without a machinist.

Quick update as I just remembered something from my research last night which I did do, thank you very much. None of your sources say anything about the cross-compatibility of stocks between British Imperial vs Metric models. However, on a forum that I read last night, it seems like the the FAL series stocks are not compatible with L1A1 series without modification. Any confirmation on that?

A critical challenge not mentioned and that would be the folding cocking handle on the C1A1.

Next comes the dust cover with the stripper clip fitting. You'll need to create a mock breechblock carrier under that too as it looks like the KA one is just a shell.

After that the Canadian flash hider and the rear sight.

Then the shaped plastic carry handle and wood furniture. You may be able to find some of the real stuff online to bolt up. I think the fore grip isn't so bad, but the the pistol grip and stock are tougher.

Don't worry about the arctic trigger. It wasn't in common use. People would just put their mitts on a dummy string and flick them off for winter warfare.

You would have better luck cosmetically starting with the Ares SLR, but it's got problems of it's own. If you read some reviews of the Star version you'll see.

FN FAL and L1A1 or C1A1- Part 4 - YouTube

Differences between Inch and Metric

Inch
1.Stud sling swivel on stock
2. Serrated gas block
3. Heavy plate magazine lip
4. Rail for cocking handle stops before the receiver ring, allows for folding cocking handle to fold flat
5. Much larger magazine recess for the magazine catch

Metric
1. Inset sling swivel
2. Threaded gas block
3. Small notch magazine lip
4. Rail for cocking handle goes all the way to the front
5. Small magazine recess for the small magazine lip

Main question now that's left, is how well do the parts between KA FAL and real steel fit into each other. If the cross compatibility is high, then the main challenge would be acquiring real steel parts. If the cross compatibility is low, then the main challenge would be getting a machinist to modify the rifle itself.

Edit:

http://www.popularairsoft.com/review...itish-l1a1-slr

Seems like Kings Arms are making their own L1A1.

From what I've read, seems like the only modifications needed to convert a L1A1 to C1A1 is adding the Canadian rear sight, stripper clip-guide breech block modifications, and the wooden furniture. It's even got the fold away trigger guard which is great.

I may be totally wrong but is the KA L1A1 not an "Inch" pattern with the folding charging handle? Ya I know it will do full auto but I thought this gun was the closest to a C1A1 in the limited amount of research I did for building a C1A1 before totally giving up on the idea.

According to the link in my last post, they do have the folding cocking handle. So yeah, closest thing to a C1A1. Now all I need to know is whether I can buy real steel C1A1 dust cover/clip guide rail and fit them on the KA L1A1, or if I have to get a machinist to CNC cut parts for it.

There are parts out there

you will likely need to get an account on Canadian Gunnnutz and start asking..

I have see C1A1 parts for sale.. wood, sights, carry handles, flash eliminators

But whether or not they could be fitted onto the KA L1A1 receiver is the biggest issue atm. If KA L1A1 uses a real steel spec receiver, then it should be no problem. On the other hand, if it's not, then best case scenario, little modification is required. Worst case, parts would be completely incompatible.

Well there are a few ways to look at this. Either someone has done it, or perhaps you might be the first. No one is saying they have done it.

So I guess you have to buy the gun and the parts and see if it works. Chances are the reciever is not a real steel spec. How is your fabricating skills? Or do you have access to someone who can fabricate parts. I have some experience in fabrication (through stock car racing) and access to welders, plasma cutters etc...

At the end of my research I didn't think I had the skill to build this gun. So I didn't try.

That's the first I've seen of that KA version. All the ones I've held I'd call Belgian vs. Commonwealth.

Did some searching using CANADIAN FNC1 and CANADIAN FNC1 PARTS and found the parts you need:) FNC1 is how we called that weapon in the Canadian forces.

Here's a few links to get you started:

http://www.falfiles.com/forums/showt...hreadid=299492


http://www.google.ca/imgres?q=CANADI...t:429,r:7,s:41

Yeah that is another way of looking at it. There is actually three types, Inch (Commonwealth, L1A1, SLR, C1A1 etc..) Metric (Belgian, Brazil, FN exports etc...) and Indian (which has features of Inch and Metric.) There are also Israeli parts from their FAL's that are different too.

It's kind of confusing but generally the Inch guns were licensed copies made in the country they were used in, for instance Canada's rifles were built by Canadian Arsenal Limited at Longbranch, Ontario (the Federal armoury for many years, they built Sten guns during WWII).

The thing that kiboshed this project for me was the stripper clip upper.

http://www.dsarms.com/T48_C1A1-Strip...ctinfo/035STP/

http://www.dsarms.com/images/035STP.gif

Dimitri

Thanks for the link Dimitri...

I might rethink this project now.

30$ gets you the cover, American's love them, due to the amount of surplus ammunition on stripper clips they have been importing.

Dimitri

So correct me if I'm wrong, but if I were to swap real steel parts for KA L1A1 parts to make it a C1A1, I would need a

1. SPF FNC1A1 rear disc rotary sight 200 to 600 yds
2. Wooden Furniture
- SPF Canadian Carry Handle
- FNC1A1 Stock
- FNC1A1 Handguard
3. Stripper Clip Top Cover (which replaces the dust cover)
4. SPF Canadian Breach Block
5. SPF Canadian Breach Block Carrier

Anything I should add or remove, or correct from this list? Specifically, the breach block carrier, I don't suppose real steel would work, no?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L1A1_Self-Loading_Rifle
Also, butt-stocks are not interchangeable, since the stocks on metric pattern and inch pattern guns attach in different ways.

So does anyone know which type of buttstock attaches onto the KA L1A1? Metric or Inch?

If the KA doesn't have the sand slots milled into the carrier then it's fine.

All of the real steel parts mentioned here, Butt, front end, muzzle, handle, pistol grip and such are, or were, easy enough to source, I still have them all from when I was planning to do this project myself took me little over a month to find them, so, most likely, if I could find them you can too. Not as many around now as there used to be but just look and you'l find them.

Never got far enough into the project to discover fitment.

I don't know if this counts as a necro, but is there any news on this project? I remember one Japanese guy at a Flag Raiders outdoor game a few years ago who had a C1. If only I could remember his name, I'd suggest maybe getting in touch him him.


If it helps to recall, he had a scratchbuilt MG34 there with him as well.

so what is the word nowadays about the FNC1 airsoft rifle? I used to carry the real one in the military years ago, and was usually an FNC2 gunner. I would love to find one, I have alot of gear left from the real weapon.

You and me both. It is unfortunate but King Arms seems to have discontinued production of their L1A1 SLR which is as close as you are going to get without having to modify. To be honest the only thing dif is the butt stock (funny enough the one on their FN FAL is closer to the Can one) and the upper cover with stripper clip. And of course..the wood furniture is dif. there are a few other issues but, in my opinion, not worth the trouble.