![]() |
New CA 249 MKII Issues
One of my friends just receive is CA 249 today. It was a little late to shoot it outside (around 10 pm) so we decided to shoot some BB inside to see what this beast was able to do. We put around 400 BB in the CA minimi box mag. First I do a 2 sec burst, "WOW! amazing ROF". Lets see another 2 sec burst, "Man this thing rock!". Afther this two short burst, my friend ask me to do a longer burts (around 5 sec.) to see if the box mag was feeding properly when suddenly...BOOM! Nothing was coming out of the gun. The motor was turning and we can hear the gear too but nothing else... I oppened the mechbox to discover that the four last tooth of the piston was no more... :banghead: . I think we will have to test it outside another day :cry: .
By the way, sorry for my bad english. |
i guess that's what PGC meant when CA stole/copied their V2 design and that it had a major flaw in it. supposed to be fixed in a PGC V3 and i bet CA will steal the design again
|
OUCH. Piston shreddies.
Is it similar to a standard AEG piston? |
Mine did the same thing when I first got it, just replace it with a stock piston and you won't have a problem with it.
|
Yes Madmax, it's similar to a standard piston.
|
well, at least that's an easy part to replace. It'd suck if you needed a CA M249 piston.
|
what battery do you use? do not use 9.6V or you'll easily shred piston or gears.
|
People have been having mixed success. Some are working great and some need the internals replaced or tuned up. Sounds like standard CA problems. Nothing to really worry about.
Other then the fact your dropping 1600 for a gun that should last a while. But hell its way better then a TOP m249 |
hate to jack threads, but which retailer did you go went through to get your CA249? or your friends for that matter?
|
Unfortunately other then say TM most manufacturers seem to use the clients as the testers.
Demand is so high for new guns they rush them out the door with very little testing. The good thing is they copied TOP and PGC so most the R&D is there. Its just they use shitty internals or slap em together badly. |
guess i'm not the only one with the exact same problem
9.6V large batt put in, less than 5 min into a game, all i was getting, the sound of motor turning..talking about CA quality:confused: at least overall quality is more than satisfactory |
:-D pics please!
|
from what i read, the majority of the CAM249s have the piston problem. pull them and toss in a stock marui piston. works fine.
|
CA internals have always been known to be "iffy". Some people have been successful with stock CA internals, while most others don't. My CA MP5 stock internals lasted me 2 years. While my CA M4 died right out of the box. :p
Good thing about this M249 is the fact the internal parts are easily found and replaceable. |
Good to know I have a TM piston just sitting here waiting to go in it! :-)
|
I think I read in a review somewhere that there was supposed to be a warning that came with the gun. It indicated that you should make sure to turn the hop-up off prior to shooting. The gun may come with the hop-up on (or partially on). Some users have reported they missed that step and it resulted in bbs jamming and killing the gears/teeths in the internal.
|
What I read in the e-mail sent to Apoc regarding a CA notice was to not turn the hop up on too far as it'll cause that problem.
Overall, the mech box is easy to remove (WAY too easy!!!!) and there are 8-9 screws to take out. Swapping the piston should take no more than 20mins from start to finish. Best to just put in a stock piston and have fun. Apoc's has been through over 5000rds so far and it's still banging along. Oh, I should say that we tried to install an aluminun piston we had lying around as a spare, and it wouldn't work at all. Noticed the groove in the piston wasn't as wide as the rail on the mechbox sides and it was jamming up huge. We filed the piston groove wider and it worked, but not very well with that piston. From that point we put in the stock piston and perfection was achieved. Nutshell, avoid aluminum pistons in this gun. |
What's wrong with that fuc@#* CA 249. I've just put a TM piston (not a new one but in really good shape) and look what append. By the way I run it on a large 8.4V Ni-Cad battery. Don't want to open the box every 300 rounds. :-x
|
Quote:
I got a polycarb as a replacement. much better build good for another 30k atleast |
beats me
apoc put in a TM piston and ran about 8,000 rounds through it already without any problems |
eventually people will learn... i guess
|
What do you mean Vond???
|
he think Classic Army are shitty guns... (from experience i guess)
I have a Ca33e and its works fine, shot over 8000 bbs with it. btw Welcome back Vondnik, hope your coming to september 3rd DoW game :) |
Getting a CA gun is like playing Russian roulettes...
|
Yes but in this case getting a m249 from CA will still cost 1000$ less then a similarly equipped TOP. So even if you have to spend some money on the internals its a good way to go to get a m249. As far as the AR's go I would never get one.
|
Let you know to watch out for the micro switch that triggers the gun. Apoc's broke last night. The metal bar that the trigger presses on to activate the switch is steel and bent at a sharp 90 angle. This one snapped off when trying to reinstall the mechbox, the wires decided to move where they would jam up, and trying to pull the mechbox back to reroute the wires caught the metal bar and snapped it. Try to fix or find a replacement? Good fucking luck!!! Great system overall, but it's without it's problems.
My guess is that even if the gun is never opened up, that micro-switch will fail just by using it regularly. Figures that they'd use some cheap jap/taiwan/chinese companie's custom switch, and nothing similar to other AEGs to make replacement easier. At least something that can be FIXED without much trouble!!!! |
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
Poncho, you have no idea how different this mechbox is compared to other known mechboxes! It's a totally new design, it's completely rectangular and super easy to remove and take apart/reassemble. Best yet, the spring doesn't get put under any tension until after you reassemble the mechbox. It's not even a TM Version 6 that fits in the P90 (as assumed early on. I'll take a pic and post it, there are no compatible parts with this and other mechboxes except the gears and some other internals. Even comes with 8mm bearing bushings!
Edit: Here's the pic. Note I didn't bother putting the spring guide in this pic. http://www.foxdenairsoft.com/images/...hbox.sized.jpg Anyways, Apoc just took the switch to Active Electonics here and found an identical switch and dropped it off. Here are the replacement specs on it for those that want a spare or to replace the exisiting one. The stock one is XURUI XV-152-1C25 (good luck on an internet search!!!): GC Switch #35-844 Momentary - Miniature Snap Action Switch SPDT (Single Pole Dual Throw) Actuator: Lever Cost is $4.49 This switch is identical, even down to the mounting holes. Good news for all the new CA M249 owners out there. |
I guess the one thing that would irk me is the non standard piston groove sizes - I find with all AEG's if something is off by so much as a millimeter, it tends not to work. Pretty amazing tolerances for such simple mechanics, but who am I to argue. I wonder then if this mechabox is similar to the Thompson M1 AEG, not the V.6.
Good work on the switch, Active has some pretty excellent stuff. Hope to see that M249 up and running on Sept.3 and not conking out in true AEG LMG form (past TOP experiences) |
Thanks Poncho, it'll be up & running by Rawdon. The switch is working just fine, as with the original the lever has to be bent in a certain way to get it to contact the set screw on the trigger as well as remain out of the way of the spur gear when it spins. Hopefully we can catalog all the issues with this gun and get the info to Classic Army in hopes they will take problems into account and fix the design. They *seem* to be pretty decent about improving on customer complaints and as such various new versions tend to be better than the previous type. This mechbox is thick as they come (thicker actually) and the design is sound, just needs fine adjustments in materials (such as the ultra thin anti-reversal latch spring) and design (to make it such that the hop up setting isn't seen as a "Low hop up, gun works fine. Enough hop up for .25g, the piston shreds") to overcome the problems. I don't understand the wide piston grooves either, hopefully they'll explain.
As far as the mechbox used in the Thompson, I doubt it, while I haven't opened an M1 yet, this mechbox is huge in comparison to the M1 Tommy's I've seen on the field. I think this is an 'M249 specific' design. |
Ok, I'm posting a reply to this instead of editting my previous post because I want this brought to people's attention and not fall by the wayside with a simple edit.
If you break your lever on your switch, buy the switch I outlined above. BUT, DO NOT USE IT!!!!! I went through two of them and after a few shots the contacts siezed (welded together) and saw on the package that they are rated for 15A@125VAC, and 1/4A@125VDC. Since we're dealing with DC, and we fuse for 15A+, having a rating of 1/4A really doesn't do crap. So, since I am the first that has successfully done this, at least in Canada, chances are the entire world, here is what you do. Take a drill with a drill bit bigger than the end of the rivet holding the swtich assembly together. Drill it out, remove the rivet, then use a small screwdriver to pry the two halves apart, enough to remove the steel lever. The base of it is identical to the stock supplied one. Drill out the rivet on the supplied switch, separate it and swap the new lever for the broken on. you do NOT need to take the mechbox apart, just undo the two screws holding the switch in the mechbox and pull the switch out the bottom. Make sure you put the connectors in the same place you took them from, the battery wire goes to the top (Com) and the wire that goes to the motor goes to the NO (Normally Open) tab (if you accidentally put it on the NC, Normally Closed tab, the gun will fire until you pull the trigger, where it will stop til you release it.) Reassemble, all should be good. Make sure you bend the lever so that the end of it is nowhere near the sector gear, else it'll grab and bend your lever, fucking your gun & fuse good. |
Thanks for the info Poncho and Stalker. I will let you know what append when the new piston comes in...
|
No prob, that's what the word "community" really means.
Do this. When you have the mechbox open, install the piston (with white lithium grease on the rails) and with your fingers slide it back & forth, It should move nicely, without binding anywhere. The stock TM piston works well so far, but we'll have to keep up on this. Since I have a heavy trigger finger with an M249 as a teammate, guaranteed I'm gonna be the one with a good share of the info. The design is beautiful, but it has wrinkles still that need working out. Any info found, fixed, etc. will benefit this thread and the rest of the owners out there. This is all referance, pure & simple. It's not about 'Dr. Airsofter' glory. All that I find, I post in as much detail as possible, especially since the Classic Army M249 is so new there is little info at all available as it if, let alone problems and fixes. |
btw the thompson mechbox is the same as the p90. It's a version 6 mechbox and is nothing like what I'm seeing here. I'll have one of those boxes in my hand later this week or next weekend and will be able to compare as I have a M1 on my workbench
|
CA=Capitalist Army
why make a good quality product when they're making a killing on crap? |
Off topic Nuck. I RARELY agree with you on things, but that avatar is hilarious!!!!
|
I was all set to get one of these but after this I think i'm gonna wait and see how CA handles this.
|
Just buy one and replace the piston with a stock TM piston right away, and you'll be fine. Overall this is a most excellent gun, all metal with plastic grip, foregrip and stock. Can easily fit a 9.6V battery in there, break out the tabs and put a 10.8V in there. Super easy to work on, shoots real nice. Overall, just buy it and replace the piston is all this thread is about. I added the bit about replacing the switch, but it's only if you break it off, it's not a thing that'll happen with each gun, just the piston is.
|
Got to use Apoc's CA M249 today. Worked flawlessly. A very heavy gun compared to my little M4. Was able to with stand alot of fire. Looks like all the problems on his gun have been worked out.
|
Funny thing about Warmongers (referring to Shagg's comment), we tend to never bullshit anyone. Ok, bragging as much as the next airsoft guy sure, but bullshitting, never. Lol, dont' mind me, just on a bit of a tear.
|
|
Here's a gathered list of problems as well as reviews and posts I've been reading about the CA249. If anything is wrong, please post corrections so I can fix it up!
Problems with Solutions 1. Piston Stripping after a short number of rounds solution - don't turn hopup too high, change piston (CA's are known to be very brittle) 2. Micro switch faulty solution - be aware when taking mechbox out Quote:
solution - problem with mircro switch in general, be aware of this problem when in safezone 4. Box Mag plastic a bit weak (reports of cracking after game use) solution - none at the moment, just be aware of this 5. 8.4V Large Batteries not fitting in stock solution - plug the battery in first, shove the wiring in, then fuse then battery and it will fit 6. Bipod leg/s don't fold down properly solution - none at the moment, not a problem on all ca249's (QC problem) Review's for CA249's:: http://www.ukasc.net/content.php?review.81 or http://www.airsoftcommunity.co.uk/fo...howtopic=49850 http://www.airsoftextreme.com/ca249review.htm http://www.lonestarairsoft.com/forum...ticle&artid=10 http://www.21stcenturyairsoft.com/forum/post-4088.html http://www.airsoftretreat.com/forums...rchTerms=ca249 Other threads regarding CA249's:: http://www.arniesairsoft.co.uk/forum...pic=24379&st=0 |
Quote:
God I love the M14!!!! Quote:
If this happens on occasion with the stock switch, I think i has something to do with the way the lever is postioned and/or the height of the set screw on the trigger (pull trigger, a sear moves up and it has a long set screw on it that is adjustable....... that set screw presses the lever activating the switch). If you lower the set screw, there would be less pressure on the lever, possibly fixing the problem. |
About the switch sticking problem and the gun firing off on its own. That is not exclusive to the CA m249. It can also be a problem with the TOP m249. Its due to the use of a microswitch period. The switch requires very little physical movement to activate. Any small debris can get in there and possibly cause it to activate.
Couple years ago with mine I had the very embarrassing incident of the M249 start shooting automatically in a safe zone. It stiched a guy up the leg from less then 10 feet away and he had very bad welts all over his leg. Trigger was safed and everything and it just started to go to town the moment I picked up off the tailgate of my truck. Luckily nobody was shot in the eye or anything as it was a very dangerous situation having a machine gun shooting on its own accord in the safe area. Please be careful where the muzzle is pointed at all times. Even when the Gun is "Safed." |
I'd like to clear a little thing up. The reason the switch broke on Apoc's gun was because when we were first replacing the piston we managed to mangle the little metal lever then bend it back into place. This was BEFORE Stalker ever got a chance to look at it so when it broke easily for him, it had allready taken a huge beating beforehand.
What happened to the switch is really simple and stupid. The little metal leaf that hangs off the switch sits out over the mechbox gears that are exposed on the bottom. While handeling the mechbox to test fire it I pushed the metal bit too far and it got caught on the gears bending the fuck out of it... Normally the trigger can't push the switch that far but when pushing it with your fingers be VERY CAREFUL and you shouldn't have any problems... G'luck all you M249'ers. It's an awseome gun with one of the simplest and strongest mechbox designes I have ever seen... - Quantis |
Heh, and I felt like absolute crap when it busted on me, and they let me stew in it for a couple hours before they let me know the switch lever was tampered with before I got it, so it wasn't 100% my fault. Buggers!! At least they bought the steaks for the Warmonger BBQ!
Anyways, the fix info still stands. |
Quote:
|
Hey man, that comment can't be taken back no matter how you beg for it! And $1600 is on the high end from what I've heard from a couple guys. Dunno if the boxmag is included though.
Sorry, some people just suck. Like me. Maybe my g/f sticks around and puts up with all my airsoft crap because I suck........... well. *shaking head, I am typing this for what reason?* |
Quote:
So I really can't take it back. I am sorry that you bought a m249 so close to CA's release date though. :-( I am sorry to have offended any TOP owners. |
Quote:
|
Hello fellow CA249 owners,
Mine still has the stock piston, running on a Guarder SP110 spring and a 9.6V 3600mah battery. I put around 4-5K rounds through the gun so far, it feeds great. However, last weekend, I encountered the microswitch/wiring(?) problem - gun firing with the safety on, or firing extra rounds after the trigger is released. Can anyone tell me what is the amp rate of the stock CA microswitch? TOP 249+PGC gearbox owners say the solution is a 25A (or 30A) rated microswitch. |
The stock one is rated 20 Amp.
|
Quote:
|
This is my experience with the CA m249.
after a about 1k rounds in stock form with a 9.6v battery, I opened it and saw that the piston was heavily worn. I replaced most of the internals with sytema gears, silent head set, deepfire titanium piston and an m120 spring. Shot about 2k rounds then the gears and piston seized. To make a long story short, the titanium piston survived, the gears got eaten up and a bushing broke. First thought that came to mind was "crap! where am I gonna find an 8mm bushing?" So stick with "plastic" pistons. Cheaper to replace pistons than gears and bushings. I searched online airsoft stores to no avail. Then I found a site that specializes in bearing bushings. I measured the stock bushings and found bushings that closely matched the dimensions of the stock bushings. Stock bushings are flanged, 3mm bore, 8mm outer diameter, and 4mm width. I found bushings that were 3mm x 8mm x 3mm. I got the bushings today and they fit almost perfectly...just need to add couple more shims than usual. But price was a staggering $49.95 for a set of 10. Here is a link, http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/3mm/Kit6915 So now I have a stock TM piston, systema alum piston head,stock cylinder head, stock piston, and an 8.4v battery. So far, the gearbox is cycling properly. I haven't taken it out yet. Will let you guys know the results. |
So what spring would you say would lower it to a safe ROF when using a large 9.6V? Or should you stick with an 8.4 even when upgraded?
|
I had a bushing go on me as well (inner sleeve jammed on the bevel gear axle, and had to pry it off), and luckily all the parts, bearings, sleeves, etc were found, so after greasing the bearing holder to stick the BBs in, I was able to put the bushing itself back together and it's working just fine now (did that the day before last Sunday's game, and Apoc blasted through a good couple box mags worth of BBs) so it's holding.
Good link to put up for reference. Might be expensive for one player to replace one bearing, but if that one player buys the set of 10, he can then sell to others to recover his cost. |
I would think an m130 would reduce the fps down to a level comparable to an m120 with 8.4v. however, the m130 might bring fps to about 450...which is over the limit where I play. My CA249 is already chronoing at 420fps with the m120s. I somehow need to get the spring to settle to reduce yhe velocity a bit.
|
What upgrades you guys recommend if I want to run a Guarder SP120 spring?
SP110 seems to cycle fine with the stock parts... |
how good is the ROF with an 8.4 and an M120?
|
Tonight, I removed and opened the factory microswitch (made by XURUI, XV-152-1C25, 20A, 125/250VAC) . It's a piece of crap!
First of all, the plastic casing is not heat resistant. The contacts are not made of copper, only copper coated. I discovered serious burning marks, down to the bare metal. I repaired the switch (temporarily, until better replacement) and installed an extra part to reduce spark formation. I also inspected the hop-up, it's dog eared after 5K rounds. Any recommended brand for replacement? |
Im gonna have to experiment on the nozzle. Im gonna mod the nozzle making notches/channels so that when there is a jam in the hopup that the nozzle doesnt make a perfect seal with a bb...so that the piston could move all the way forward. Im gonna have to make sure fps and accuracy doesnt get affected much.
Any inputs? |
Does the ca249's nozzle have a cross shaped indentation within the inner diameter of the nozzle? If not, I'd suggest this.
|
yes it does. maybe its not letting enough air out fast enough when there is a jam.
|
Anyone had problems with the fuse blowing frequently? Just test fired mine - fuse blew right away (out of the box). *lol* Changed to a new 25A fuse... seemed to fire fine. I put the stock back on, it stopped firing. So I checked the fuse - busted again.
I'm going to try a stronger fuse, otherwise bypass it altogether. Guess it's something else to watch out for with the CA249. EDIT: Oh, I was using a standard 8.4v 2400mAh large battery. |
update
Well, after some trouble with piston and gears, my CA249 is shooting great. Chronoed at 360fps with 0.25's. ROF was excellent. I shot about 3000 rounds today at a game.Not a single problem. The battery was still going strong. The box mag fed really good. No misfeeds or jams. I sprayed some silicone oil into the hopup chamber before the game to help prevent jams. Internally, the piston is in excellent condition. No signs of wear *knock on wood*. Now Im happy. I downgraded to 8.4v 3300 Current mods: prometheus gears (for MS100 / MS110 Spring) TM stock piston systema pom piston head with bearings m120s systema m16 tightbore systema NB cylinder |
phalanix,
Sounds like a f**ed up battery, or the wires shorted on something. The stock can peel the wires, it happened to me (but no fuse popped). |
Battery's fine - I use it in my other AEGs. It may be the wiring - but haven't had time to check internals yet. I did buy a set of stronger fuse, haven't tried it out yet either.
And yup, my stock had peeled a bit of my red wire as well. |
Any idea on the outer barrel thread type?
|
Quote:
|
After 10k rounds, I chrono'd my 249 and it's only 270-280fps with .25BB +SP110 spring (290-310 with SP120). Pretty bad air leak, eh? I have no experience in fixing leaks, what you guys recommend?
|
silicon oil first. Heavy stuff works nice. Around the cylinder head and any O rings that you can find.
I took apart the aug after about 20k and did that (and at the same time a piston upgrade), everything improved after the oiling. |
Well that can't be a huge air leak. I mean, even on that spring - the 110 I mean - if it's shooting 270-280 with .25s thats what? Nearly 320-330 with .2s if I remember correctly? And 290-310 with the 120 would probably be close to 350-360 with .2s. I could be wrong because I'm not really too familar with the Guarder springs, I've only used the Systema and PDI ones.
But after 10,000+ rounds (Especially continuous like in a SAW) I would definitely go with lubing up the entire mechbox internals, especially the cylinder walls, piston head o-ring, and the hop bucking with the appropriate greases. And if you do pull the box apart, pull the cylinder out and try to run the greased piston up and down the cylinder while holding your finger over the air nozzle hole - if the piston is hard to push into the hole, you're getting a good air seal on that end. I'm currently waiting to join the CA M249 club myself - if only they'd hurry up and release the Para. Has anyone had any more problems out of the microswitch? Or are they doing any better? |
Thanks for the tips guys.
Should I order gearbox/piston greases made for AEGs, or I can use anything that is not too thick and not petroleum based? |
I use spray lithium white grease for any of my internal stuff - both cylinder, piston and gear grease. I've found it makes excellent seals and keeps good lubrication on the gears. I've also found that when I use lithium grease, it actually gets the gun a tad few more fps than guns just lubricated with normal AEG type grease. I found my huge spray can of Lithium Grease at an automotive parts store. Any place like that should have it.
As for the hop up of course, just use 100% silicon oil - never any kind of penetrating oil - as it will literally eat your hop up unit and anything else rubber or plastic. |
Quote:
And about the micro-switch issue, Apoc's has been through about a half dozen games (about 15,000 rounds) since we 'fixed' the switch and not a problem since, so it's holding. As is the stock TM piston we put in there. |
Quote:
|
Wow - I didn't know they were that powerful. I guess he does have one heck of an air leak. My mistake.
I hope the Para version will be just like TOPs and be able to hold a brick shaped 9.6V 1500-1700 mah AUG type battery. I'm probably going to just buy 2 or even possibly 3 of them just to make sure I can keep spittin' bbs. :D My problem with the Mk II is that it's pretty long and our team does a mix of woodland and close combat, so I'd like to be able to use the Para as more of a large capacity assault rifle in CQC instead of having to wield an M16 length LMG around those tight corners. |
The 249P in CQC gonna be nightmare to the enemy. :)
|
guys,
the nozzle, cylinder head, cylinder that comes with CA 249's..are they replaceable with TM internals? if so, what type of mechbox will it be? thanks in advance :nod: |
The parts are all fully interchangable, but the size is what's going to get you. On the Mk II, I'd ASSUME - and they say where that gets you - but I'd assume it'd be the same as an M16 cylinder since it has no ports in it, and a regular version 2 cylinder head since the Mk IIs barrel is about on par with the size of an M16 barrel.
The air nozzle might be a tad trickier - they could've used any kind of nozzle for it. But it'd make the most sense that CA transfered parts from the M15 series for the internals in the M249, since they'd be readily available and they wouldn't have to retool their machines and make completely new parts for a single line of guns. On the Para version, I would safely bet, the cylinder will probably be ported since it has basically an M4 inner barrel, so it wouldn't need the compression the Mk II is getting, so the cylinder there would probably match with a TM or Systema M4 type cylinder. Hope this helped. |
I was crusing over the CA site and it looks like they are selling replacement micro switches. Not sure if you guys know this but it wasnt here. With any luck ill be joining the club monday :)
|
|
I know tree M249 in the hands of local players used weekly but only 1 have the piston problems while the other two are working fine.
It was a curious case becasue after the original CA pìston was riped, we try two Area1000 pistons and two piston were riped out. The third replacement was an CA original and the problem was aparently solved (after two months the owner have no issues about the AEG). In the box there was a paper sheet from the European distribuitor warning about the 9.6 volts batterys and (pay attention guys) the excesive hop-up (turn all the left). If you are lucky and have no piston problems you have a serious and well made AEG even if you have problems it could be quickly and easily resolved. Un saludo. |
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 23:33. |
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.