Why are younger players frowned upon so much?
 

I'm not posting this thread to evoke an argument in anyway. I'm actually curious as to why people tend to dislike when younger people play? (Under 18)

Obviously, people dislike the immature kids who run around in public with their guns. I get that, but what I don't understand is why people tend to lash out on the more mature players, the ones who actually conceal their guns, play on real fields and respect the sport.

Again, just curious - not trying to evoke a flame war.

I have shot with younger kids. I even lead a bunch of them for the last LZ game. I don't have a problem with the kids, on a personal level, most of the time: The problem comes with the legal association with shooting at a minor.

If I took that kids eye out because his goggles had failed, I would feel horrible, knowing he was not of the age of consent to play (regardless of parent's permission).

Secondly, I don't have two settings while playing, I don't have "kid friendly mode". There are some things you shouldn't say / do around kids which is 100% fine as an adult (insert chuckles, but seriously).

I think these are the two main sources of troubles with shooting with kids, other than maturity issues, that a lot of people face.

Me it's more the legal side with kids. If something happen to one of them and a soccer mommy gets in all this, your pretty fucked up IMO. The only minor I play with it's my little brother, because he's aware of the danger of the sport and I know hes intelligent enought to not take is gun in public.

Yeah there's a big liability issue. I know laws are different here (Quebec) than the rest of Canada but there are probably similar issues. If you injure a kid here, no amount of waivers or parental consent is going to protect you if the parents decide to take action against you.

edit: that isn't to say you can't win in court... but nobody feels like going to court: that's just a nightmare in a bottle. So we don't allow kids. Some paintball places allow minors, and I guess it falls under their insurance or whatever. That's fine, their problem. But most games here are on private land.

Isn't there a sticky thread on this yet?

No one looks down on the younger players. they just don't want to play with them.

look at it this way.. you and your 14 year old buddies are all doing 14 year old stuff and hanging out together .. and an 8 year old comes along and says "hey can I play too?"

what do you say? you probably don't want this "kid" jamming up your 14 year old vibe, What if he falls down and starts crying? what if he's too slow and keeps holding you up, but you don't want to leave him behind now, because he's followed you away from home, and now you feel kinda responsible for the Kid. But he's really getting in the way?

would it not be a lot easier if he stayed in the sand box with the other 8 year olds and stopped trying to "fit in" with the older kids?

well it's exactly the same , when a 16 year old kid wants to come pay with the 30 somethings.. except worse.

1- You can't sign my waiver, which means when you die at my game your parents will come looking for you and I will have to move your body.

2 - What Brian said. (Brilliant analogy Wood....brilliant.)

I think your mistaken, who lashes out on mature kids?

The issue is younger people have less realization and experience in general.

18 is just the number when you become legally responsible, there is idiots on both sides of it.

I know a kid who has strived to learn all the responsibilities of airsoft when he was 15 and he accepted a lot of criticism from people of age and now after being taught a few things he's a respectable player. He's 16/17 now and he really wants to play more than 'backyard skirmishes' but I told him- its great your respecting the sport and i've seen people older than him that have no idea what that mean but there is still a legality.

Also as Brian said, and being a young person myself, we don't always get along with older people because they have more experience and we have different interests.

At the same time I play with a lot of older people and they realise my age and treat me no different. After all were still just playing with toys right ;)

This is what I always say..

you will be too young for a couple of years and too old the rest of your life.

I would eat the hearts of a thousand virgins to crawl back into a 14 year old body... but then I'd probably just abuse it like I did the one I have...

Just called you OLD .

Old guys have less free time than young kids with nothing but free time so we respect it more. We call our hits, so we can go back to the safe zone and take a hit of Oxygen.
Young guns and Old Guys speak different languages too, When an Old guy says IN he means IN when a Young Gun says "In" it means "Maybe if my buddies Mom will drive us".
we don't know what you mean when you say "Thats so Random. "
When discussing New AEG prices you say Thats Expensive and we say Thats Fkn Cheap and we are talking about the same AEG price.
We have a respect for other players and their things and young guns have a lack of common courtesy for other players and their stuff.
Don't argue with the stuff presented in this Post, we know better, if you disagree your actions will speak louder than your web-blathering.
Cheers


and then there's the creepy shit.....

:)

I'm a young-guy-turned-old-guy *sigh*.

Old guys know who this is.
http://t6ak.roblox.com/977e3620b2fc1611ac84089398f41215
Young Guns think it's Pedo Bear

The age thing isn't an argument for maturity
I've seen just as many young kids cheat as young adults cheat as older guys cheat. I've seen young and old argue the most ridiculous things on the field. I've seen grown men whine like 12yr olds, and 12yr olds tell people to stop complaining.
You are who you are, and that's just how it is.

Most dangerous age seems to be 18-22 honestly.
The younger crowd is typically in better shape, but it's easier to teach the more milsim side of airsoft to older guys, especially the individual tactics.

I'd say any argument of age for maturity is invalid, it's all about how the person is taught and how they grew up.
So the main reason most people don't allow minors is for legal reasons.

Do Tell.......

They don't???? I grew up on those comics and I'm a pretty young guy (I think).

Although I just realized that book on my bookshelf is like 30 years old cause I know my dad got it around the time when it was first published.

Garfield

When I play I look for three things:

1. Is the player safe? Do they take responsibility for their actions. Do they think before they shoot. I tend not to like being lit up in the back of the head from a foot away. Generally more mature players will be more aware and not take dangerous shots.

2. Do they play fair? Do they call their hits? Do they load to game regs?

3. Are they fun to be around? I'm less interested in playing with good shooters and prefer to play with guys who are out to have a good time. If they take a hit and bitch about it for 45 minutes and ruin the game for everyone else then I'm not interested in playing with them.

Now some youths do follow all these rules and I have no problems playing with them, but I'd rather not take the chance with someone who because of their age would have a predisposition to being immature. Hell there are enough adults that cheat and ruin the game for others I'm disinclined to chance playing with teens.

possession.. not just 9/10ths of the law...

Pookey!

Be like Stealth, BB chips a tooth and continues for rest of day. Which was another good 4 hours. ;)

! On mobile; sorry for any spelling mistakes or autocorrects!

This. I'm only 23 but this is exactly right.

I did that too last summer. Fairly calmly, with only mild profanity, called my hit, walked off the field (one life only skirmish) then continued for one more game if memory serves me right, though for me it wasn't so much a chip as much of 1/2 of one of my teeth turned into powder.

I would do the same but ths time with the knowledge that I have now and my current airsoft toys.........talk about some pawnage!!

Well said!!

I have played with 8 year olds here in Japan, and I have played with 14 year olds back in Canada.

I've had young players here offer me full magazines when they heard my gun starting to shoot dry.
I've had kids in Canada lie to me and try to get around the age verification system. One from Nippawin, SK even offered to give me $50 to look the other way to verify him. I've had kids back home lie, cheat and steal from my team-mates (Layne Meier of Regina, Saskatchewan for example, his username was 'Sasksoft' and ripped off a FUCK ton of money, but didn't get charged cuz he was 16/17).

So you ask why kids are looked down upon? Because we remember the shit-heads, not the good ones.

I've never really thought about it from a legal perspective before. I'm glad that was brought up. I can see how that would be an issue.

Nice points.

Pointing a replica firearm at a kid isn't exactally my cup of tea.

It is not younger player people have a problem with but immaturity. Not saying all younger players are immature but a lot of them are immature. However, that is OK ! because I guarantee you that you are not going to be young forever. :cool:
Very soon you are going to be able to play with big boys and complain about your knee problems and back injury.


very very.....soon.

Dude, we don't play with replica's.
Explaining it will be a whole other thread.
Just don't say replica again if you are refering to an AirSoft Gun.
or I will empty my Clip on you.! ;)

IMO, Younger players (under 18), sometimes lack the social skills to play the sport we do with an older crowd.They lack respect on and off the field. Respect for other people and the honor of the sport. Mental discipline is a huge factor in our sport.

I'm not saying every younger player is such, but looking at the generation which I like to refer to as the COD age. Where kids think they are invincible and have their K7 Forcefields in play all the time.

Also the legal issues behind having a younger player on the field. If that kid ever got hurt while they were on the buisness end of your PTW. Things would not go to well for the shooter. Soccer mom's will have a hay day with that.

Lighting up a kid is not fun. As mentioned earlier, most players don't have two gears of play. It's go go go and things are said that could never be un-said.

Mature or not. Waiting till your 18 is best. Being responsible for your actions comes with age and experience.

Remember, Liars, Cheaters, Theives. They come in all sorts of shapes, ages, and sizes. That being said, over the age of 18, we can have them flogged.

Being one of the few people here that actually has experience playing with an entire league of (mostly) underage to adult players, I would have to say they're just as likely to be a bad egg as any adult.
I agree that maturity comes from personal experience, but it can also be taught to people.
Cuddy's is really strict on their player base, and the new players learn that very quickly. If they get banned, they won't be able to play airsoft again until they're 18.

I know of groups of adult players that are just horrible people, they hit the field and seem to make it their objective to ruin the game for everyone. And I know groups of kids that can do the same.
As far as kids ripping people off, well, how many of the old retailers ripped us off on a national level?

How respectable a group is on the field is determined entirely by their leadership. Cuddy's has excellent leadership, ergo their players are really good.
You find a player that can't play by the rules, you kick them out, simple as that.
If you find underage players in your areas aren't mature enough to play, chances are nobody's taken the time to teach them.

I'm not saying we should all start hosting 16+ games, but we shouldn't be bashing them either.
Whether or not a group or field allows underage players is entirely up to acceptance of legal risk and personal preference.

Personally, I know that if you don't give kids a place to play, they'll find a place. And I think it's better that we offer them a controlled environment that strongly enforces safety and integrity with instructors who know the game, as opposed to them playing in a park behind a school by themselves with no safety glasses.

i love pooky ! :)

Hehe. Good times!

Thanks, Thundercactus - nice of you to say.

Our club was created for the precise reason to give kids a safe and legal place to play. We've all heard horror stories of police rolling up on kids playng airsoft on the park.......the police having to assume the guns are real, and the kids (being kids) doing somethng stupid like holding the gun up to show them that their not 'real' guns.

As one of the only all-age clubs around (300 members, youngest is 12-ish, oldest is close to 60), we - Cuddy's Commandos - do have to be very strict with underage players. But it's not just the underage, it's noobs in general. If they come in to an environment with no rules, then there's a lot more room for them to do something stupid. We lay out the rules in detail each and every game, and enforce them as strictly as we can. I've sent guys out for the day for a single un-called BB hit. If they start playing with strict rules, then they can't really develop bad habits, as they're simply not tolerated. We've got a steady stream of new players coming out....some stay, and some come once and never again.....usually, those guys are the ones who want to run wild and don't respect the rules. If they don't leave on their own, we suggest they find somewhere else to play.

And to be clear, while we do have a few younger kids on the team, most of the under 18 croud is in the 15-17 year-old range, with an average height of about 6'2"........which tends to shatter most guys' preconceptions of under-age players, who think it's like playing inside a day-care.


Our biggest frustration comes when we go to play at an open house, where our guys get mixed in with guys from established 18+ teams, and our guys end up quitting 5 minutes into the game, saying that nobody's calling their hits, and the marshalls aren't doing anything about it.

My biggest reward is seeing dads coming out to play with their sons (and, in some cases, daughters). How many sports are there where parents can play on equal footing with their kids? They have an absolute blast, and become our most loyal members.

In general, though, our guys do remarkably well. We've had no serious injuries in the 5 years we've been playing. And, I ENJOY telling people I spend my weekends shooting at children in the woods!

That being said, however, there is and always will be a certain element within the community who are just dead set against anyone under 18 picking up a gun. I respect that, even though I find almost ALL of their reasoning (justification) to be questionable, or straight up wrong. To each his own.

Pooky rules. (so much that I even have a tattoo of him, that's just how badass he is)

/thread

Isn't it fairly easy to miss a BB hit if a mag pouch gets hit or something like that?

It's not every time someone doesn't call it, it's when its certain circumstances, which I'm sure he'll elaborate on.

There's hits, and there's hits. Sure, everyone gets hit with BBs falling out the trees (ricochets), etc.....and sure, you can get hit on the gear and not feel it. But then there are times when you see someone take a hit to the skin, and instantly flinch, swear, whatever, and keep right on playing. THOSE are the guys that grind my gears.